The Disneyland Thread fka B.Y.O.B.

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Posted by Penny Trains on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 6:52 PM

Postwar Paul
Sorry to bring that up about the sweepers, but it impressed me the effort they made to keep everything pristine.

What's to be sorry about?

Ward at work:

The ride comes to life.

Kinda hard to imagine it without the villages!

Don't you wish your backyard looked like this?

Trains, trains, wonderful trains.  The more you get, the more you toot!  Big Smile

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 9:38 PM

Coming from the G gauge persuasion, the name "Grizzly Flats " is huge, and caries almost a celebrity status. This was, of course, the name of Ward Kimall's backyard railroad. Many models have been offered in G, most notably Chloe.

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 9:42 PM

 Ward didn't mind a train, or too.

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 9:45 PM

 He was in great company...

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Posted by Firelock76 on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 9:49 PM

Look at that backhead, so clean you could eat off it!

Who says steam has to be dirty?

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 9:50 PM

Chloe. 1907 Baldwin, had hauled sugar cane in Hawai i.

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 9:54 PM

 In G, you can buy off the shelf Chloe, both types of rider cars, and the Grizzly Flats station.

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 9:59 PM

We're not done here. Ward had an 1881 Baldwin narrow gauge 2-6-0.

 The Emma Nevada.

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 10:03 PM

Emma Nevada has been offered by at least 2 different manufacturers over the years. 

 Hartland:

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 10:05 PM

And more recently

Bachmann/ Spectru m

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 10:11 PM

 Detail of Emma

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 10:19 PM

We all love to run trains, don't we ?

When I was young, Model Railroader magazine had ads from "Little Engines" in Lo mita, Ca. I used to dream of building a live steamer. I would buy their catalogues and dream of the day. I went to a few live steam meets, but it has always been out of reach financially. Still is !

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 10:24 PM

 I guess I'll just have to enjoy them whenever, and wherever I can ! 

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Wednesday, September 27, 2017 10:33 PM

Firelock76

Look at that backhead, so clean you could eat off it!

Who says steam has to be dirty?

 

It's beautiful, isn't it ? I am wondering if this is Emma Nevada ?

Very few controls: throttle, water glass, "try cocks", and the Johnson bar with Walt's foot on it. The " try cocks" are the 3 valves arranged diagonally on the right side of the boiler. The early engines did not have a water glass, only try cocks. You would crack each valve to see if water or steam came out. Then, you could judge the water level in the boiler.

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Posted by Penny Trains on Thursday, September 28, 2017 7:30 PM

This is purported to be a photo of the backhead of the Bachmann model.

I can't speak to it's accuracy but the rectangular windows in the photo you posted look right.

Where do old ticket booths go?

Apparently they end up at Ward's house!  Laugh

Everybody knows about Ward and Walt, but they don't know about coconspirator Ollie Johnston:

Really fine modeler!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ollie_Johnston

No Carolwood Pacific if not for Ollie and Ward!

Walt and Ollie:

That's not Lilly Belle!

Walt bought the "King George the V" from the Bassett-Lowke showroom in London.  Strangely enough, another future Disney legend, Harper Goff, had tried to buy the loco the same day!  Goff later joined Disney and was one of the geniuses behind Disneyland.  He's also responsible for the look of the Nautilus and later he designed the sets for Willy Wonka.  Oh, and he was also the banjo player for the Firehouse Five + Two:

Ward takes Salvadore Dali for a ride:

Walt takes Ward for a ride on Dick Jackson's home railroad:

Ollie Johnston's depot bears a definite resemblance to the G.F. station:

 

Trains, trains, wonderful trains.  The more you get, the more you toot!  Big Smile

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Posted by Firelock76 on Thursday, September 28, 2017 9:18 PM

You know, Ward Kimball must have made some pretty good money working for Disney to afford a collection like that.

And "The Firehouse Five!"  I remember seeing them on one of the "Disney's Wonderful World Of Color" TV shows back in the early 60's.  It was one of the Disneyland showcase programs and the "Firehouse Five" were playing on the "Mark Twain," complete with some New Orleans vocalists.   Makes sense, a "Dixieland/ New Orleans Jazz" concert on a a paddlewheeler.

They were GOOD too!  Looked like one hell of a party!

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Thursday, September 28, 2017 10:28 PM

Penny Trains

This is purported to be a photo of the backhead of the Bachmann model.

I can't speak to it's accuracy but the rectangular windows in the photo you posted look right.

Everybody knows about Ward and Walt, but they don't know about coconspirator Ollie Johnston:

Really fine modeler!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ollie_Johnston

No Carolwood Pacific if not for Ollie and Ward!

Walt and Ollie:

That's not Lilly Belle!

Walt bought the "King George the V" from the Bassett-Lowke showroom in London.  Strangely enough, another future Disney legend, Harper Goff, had tried to buy the loco the same day!  Goff later joined Disney and was one of the geniuses behind Disneyland.  He's also responsible for the look of the Nautilus and later he designed the sets for Willy Wonka.  Oh, and he was also the banjo player for the Firehouse Five + Two:

Ward takes Salvadore Dali for a ride:

Walt takes Ward for a ride on Dick Jackson's home railroad:

Ollie Johnston's depot bears a definite resemblance to the G.F. station:

 

 

Well, the Bachman model has a different back head than the picture of Walt and Ward. Not sure which engine this is. Would that be a Great Western "King" class Walt is purchasing?  I love those Great Western engines! Love the "Castle" class.

One thing many Yanks don't realize, or have trouble wrapping their heads around:

Many of those British engines had 3 or 4 cylinders!  2 on the outside, and 2 between the frames ! Toss that one around in your mind for a few minutes! Different engineering, different mindset.

I was aware of Ollie Jonson from the Special Features of some of these classic animated movies. They speak of the "9 old men" at Disney.

The story of Disney animation is a fascinating one.

Their fortunes and success really took off after the huge success of "Snow White and the Seven Dwarves". I think Walt " bet the farm" on this movie.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Friday, September 29, 2017 9:03 AM

Multi-cylinder steam locomotives made a certain amount of sense in the European view, it wasn't just the Brits who had them, but also the Germans and the French as well.  A multi-cylinder design lessened the weight of moving machinery and made the locomotive easier on the track, there was less pounding and dynamic augment.

The disadvantage though, and remember nothing comes free, was increased maintanence costs, those muti-cylinder locomotives were harder and more time-consuming to work on.  However, since labor costs were cheaper in Europe and most railroads on the continent were government-run they didn't have the profit drive that American railroads had.  Certainly they wanted to make  money, but it wasn't quite the concern that American 'roads had. 

ALCO pushed some three-cylinder designs here in the US in the post World War One era, but the only ones that really caught on were the Union Pacific's 9000 Class 4-12-2's.  I'm sure the UP's shopmen groaned a bit when one of them showed up for servicing.  Just about all American 'roads wanted nothing to do with multi-cylinder locomotives, the philosophy being "Get 'em in, get 'em serviced, get 'em out!"  A locomotive in the shop wasn't out making money.

And the British locomotives with inside cylinders?  Those were used in areas with tight clearances, very common on British lines, putting the cylinders inside the frame got them out of the way of possible damage.

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Posted by Penny Trains on Friday, September 29, 2017 6:51 PM

Firelock76
the "Firehouse Five" were playing on the "Mark Twain," complete with some New Orleans vocalists.

Before there was a New Orleans Square, there was New Orleans Street and big name jazz acts routinely gave floating concerts from the deck of the Mark Twain.

Dixieland at Disneyland 1963:

Kid Ory and the Young Men from New Orleans:

The Albert McNeil Choir

Al Hirt

Firehouse Five Plus 2

River Bank Seating and Bleacher Stands

Firehouse on a different day:

There was also a bandstand at the water's edge where the Disneyland Strwhatters played.

Here's something where if you blinked you missed it:

Yes, that's a McConestoga wagon!

49 served.

You could also get your fry fix at the Harbour Galley.

No fish to go with your er, umm, "chips" though.

 

Trains, trains, wonderful trains.  The more you get, the more you toot!  Big Smile

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Posted by Firelock76 on Friday, September 29, 2017 7:34 PM

All those concerts on the Mark Twain, I had no idea.

As I said, looked like one hell of a party!

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Friday, September 29, 2017 8:14 PM

Firelock76

All those concerts on the Mark Twain, I had no idea.

As I said, looked like one hell of a party!

 

Yes, and " Satchmo" himself.

here's a footnote:

the engine Walt is buying, 6000 King George V, was built at Swindon works in '27. It is a Great Western "King" class. A 4 cylinder engine, most powerful 4-6-0 in Britain. Thirty built between 1927 and 1930. King George V was displayed in the U.S. As an example of British engineering, and workmanship.

Got that out of my system, let's go back to Disneyland, shall we?

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Posted by Penny Trains on Saturday, September 30, 2017 7:42 PM

Postwar Paul
go back to Disneyland

Okey dokey.  Let's look at yesterday''s vision of the future.

The World Clock

The little ball on the side told you the minutes past the hour listed around the top.

The sun and moon told you which side was in daylight.

It was the original entrance to Tomorrowland.

It was also supposed to let you figure out the exact time anywhere on earth to the minute.  Except you had to do extra math for Newfoundland which is an hour and a half ahead of Eastern Standard Time.  Big Smile

The Dutch Boy Color Gallery 1956-1960

Futuristic, but beyond teaching kids about primary colors it likely didn't help tell anything about the future (other than that corporate advertising would get crazy by the end of the 20th century).

But they did have coloring books.

Monsanto Hall of Chemistry 1955-1966

House of the Future 1957-1967

Let there be plastics!

This looks pretty close to a future that did happen:

But the mini portable on the cabinet there was your best bet for getting a picture in those days!

Kaiser Aluminum Hall of Fame 1955-1960

20,000 Leagues Under the Sea 1955-1966

Just as he had done with Snow White (when he told Roy to sell his car to get financing) Walt bet the farm on 20k.  It nearly bankrupted the studio and ate up a lot of the funds that were allocated for building Disneyland.  But it was a blockbuster of course, and Disney ended up with a lot more money for Disneyland.  Naturally, the sets went on public display.

The Golden Arrow:

This one I wish I could have seen!

Trains, trains, wonderful trains.  The more you get, the more you toot!  Big Smile

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:51 PM

Fantastic! Thank you, again! In the special features for " Snow White" they spoke of the hand to mouth existence of the Disney studios before "Snow White". They told about the long hours of Walt, and his animation team, and Walt actually crashing and sleeping in his office. How that all changed after the film came out ! A feature length animated film, in color! And, in 1937 !

Then, they were able to move into the new studio in Burbank.

 

Also, in the early days, they referred to it as "The Disney Brothers" studio. And there was a picture in those special features that showed a 3 rail setup in the studio's lobby.

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Sunday, October 1, 2017 9:36 AM

And, they say that Walt found it amusing that after the huge success of "Snow White", all the banks were extremely eager to loan him money!

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Sunday, October 1, 2017 12:31 PM

One more thing from the special features:

Walt was a " story" man. He would gather his animators together, and proceed to act out the scenes. He clearly had a vision of exactly what he wanted.

For the "Jungle Book", he advised his team Not to read the book. " Leave the story to me". His imagination is what we see in the movies made during his lifetime.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Sunday, October 1, 2017 1:00 PM

Not unusual for filmmakers to revise, alter and adapt novels they're going to make into movies.  Sometimes the novel as it is and taken verbatim is extremely difficult to make a film from.

Mel Brooks gave a pretty good opinion of the process concerning the novel "Frankenstein" and the 1931 movie of the same name, and he was serious and not joking.  If I remember correctly he said...

"Frankenstein" the novel, and "Frankenstein" the movie are both works of genius!  First, the novel.  Who would believe a 19 year-old girl could come up with something like that?   However, "Frankenstein" the novel is impossible to make a good movie out of, so the adaptation they did in 1931 is also a work of genius! 

Walt wasn't the first, and he sure won't be the last.

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Posted by Postwar Paul on Sunday, October 1, 2017 6:58 PM

Walt was a brilliant, and very successful film maker.

I am feeling the need to take another look at "20 Thousand Leagues " 

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Posted by Firelock76 on Sunday, October 1, 2017 7:16 PM

"20,000 Leagues" is an absolute masterpiece.

Turner Classic Movies ran it one night last year, needless to say I watched it, and I'll tell you, I'd forgotten how good it really was.  Not just a kid's film, it's got a lot more depth to it (no pun intended) than people realize.

I remember a movie critics backhanded compliment from the 70's...

"So well done it's hard to believe it's Disney."

Well.  WE believe it, don't we?

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Posted by Penny Trains on Sunday, October 1, 2017 7:22 PM

Postwar Paul
"The Disney Brothers" studio. And there was a picture in those special features that showed a 3 rail setup in the studio's lobby.

I've heard of that layout from several sources but I've never seen a photo.  Sad

So where do things go after they leave a Magic Kingdom?  Well, we've seen the grave of the Nautilii and the ticket kiosk at Ward Kimball's house, so here are some more!

The Marceline Autopia.

When they closed the Midget Autopia (also known as the Fantasyland or Junior Autopia) in 1966, Walt donated it to Marceline Missouri.

It ran there until the cars were just too worn out (1977).

Track remnatnts remain to create an unusual walking path through the park.

One of the cars is on display at the Walt Disney Hometown Museum.

Which of course is located in the Santa Fe depot.

Wanna see a Moonliner?  Well, there are 3!

One is at Disneyland (known as "Moonliner III") but it's a lot smaller than the original:

The other two are in Kansas City.

One is at the Airline History Museum.

This version is known as "Moonliner II" and resided on the roof at TWA from 1955 to 1961.  When TWA ended it's sponsorship of the ride (Douglas became the sponsor from 1961 to 1966) it was sold to John May for display at his RV manufacturing plant: SpaceCraft (get it? Smile, Wink & Grin).  It sat there and was in sad shape 25 years later.

Then Dan Viets bought it and restored it to the condition you see it in at the Airline History Museum.  It was on display for awhile in Marceline first though.

The third Moonliner was built in 2006.  It was fabricated out of aluminum and weighs 2,200 pounds.  Why was it built?  "Moonliner IV" as it's known to Disney fans, was built as a replacement for "Moonliner II" when the TWA world headquarters building was restored.

It didn't make a whole lot of sense after a big budget restoration of the 50 year old M2 to put the steel model back up on the roof.  So the lightweight replacement was constructed.

And Kansas City has it's Moonliner back.

The building is now on the register of historic places and is the offices for Kansas City-based Barkley Evergreen & Partners, the largest employee-owned advertising agency in the United States.  And they have a shiny new logo.

Trains, trains, wonderful trains.  The more you get, the more you toot!  Big Smile

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Posted by Penny Trains on Sunday, October 1, 2017 8:01 PM

Firelock76
"20,000 Leagues" is an absolute masterpiece.

You'll get no arguments from me, it's my favorite movie!  Big Smile

Ever hear of the "Sunset Squid Fight"??????  Wink

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l22tsktu8D8

Peter Ellenshaw created spectacular storyboards for the film that had the fight with the giant squid taking place at dusk under a blood red sky.  Unfortunately, the backdrop people created a very "watercolor" version and it looked awful.

The original squid was also a mechanical nightmare.  Tongue Tied

There were cables everywhere and it started falling apart when it got wet.

It was decided to do the sequence in a raging thunderstorm.

The squid mark 2 used hydraulics and looked considerably more natural.

It's amazing how much of this film was shot indoors.

And it was an "indoors" that was built especially for this film.  Hence the danger to the Disneyland budget.

And here's to the designer of the coolest submarine in movie history, Harper Goff:

By the way, one of the New Guinea cannibals had "EAT AT JOE'S" painted on his forehead and he was followed by this guy:

...who had "I ATE JOE" painted on his head.  Smile, Wink & Grin

Trains, trains, wonderful trains.  The more you get, the more you toot!  Big Smile

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