Lionel Post war F3's

[Anonymous]

I recently came across lionels 2354 nyc f3.  The person I purchased it from said that it was in working order aside from cosmetic damage. When I got in home and put it on the track I can't get it to budge.  It hums for a second then shorts the entire track out.  If I try and move it along with my hand I get a lot of sparks and heat on the rollers on the center rail.  I made sure that the rails are relatively clean and are free to move. Also there are no grooves worn into the rollers and all 8 wheels are free to move.

 Any help would be appreciated.

[chuck]

What type of transformer are you usuing to power the F-3?  Some of the smaller modern units can't put out enough current to run dual horizontal open frame motors.  The more likely case is there is more wrong with the loco than mere cosmetic damage.  The E-Unit could be bad/stuck, the wiring harness should be checked as well.  You can find the internal arrangement of parts and the wiring diagram from Olsen's Toy train parts web site.

http://pictures.olsenstoy.com/2354p.htm 

[Lenny the Lion]

Sounds like you have a short somewhere. You will need to remove the body, place the engine on the track and apply power. With some luck you might find some arcing which will help you locate the problem. I'll venture to say the trouble is either in the e-unit or the motor.

Did you buy this at a train shop or on Ebay?  Have you contacted the person you bought it from?

[Anonymous]

Ebay, I have emailed the seller who hasn't answered back yet.

[USNRol]

If you wanted some more help perhaps you could post some clear pictures of the loco's internals/mechanicals so that we might spot some obvious discrepancies. 

Ebay is very tricky territory for a buyer of these popular classic PW units.  So many people are interested in buying them at any price that there is now an element of fraudulent sellers within eBay who will either misrepresent or fail to disclose in their quest for profits.  I've adopted an extremely defensive posture anytime I'm thinking about buying this type of item there.  I.E. known seller of PW items with lotso feedback, accurate description with the common points addressed.

The good news is that even if you're personally unable to repair the 2354 I'm sure that someone can; either a helpful forum member or perhaps someone at your LHS.  You're to be commended already for at least trying to resurrect this great train!

good luck,
Roland

[mpzpw3]

It sure sounds like a short somewhere. I would go ahead and remove the shell, and do a close inspection of all the wiring. It will probably be pretty obvious when you find it. Postwar F-3's are pretty much always repairable, so I wouldn't worry too much. A good servicing by you or someone else is probably in order anyway. Free rolling wheels are not alway a good sign (You should be getting a pretty fair amount of resistance through the gearing when trying to rotate the wheels by hand). I would look for some broken wire insulation, perhaps touching the frame or another wire, or look for some soldering "spatter" on the e-unit, or the solder lug on the motors. Hope this helps a little.

[Lenny the Lion]

Mustang,

How did the seller describe it's overall running condition besides there being a cosmetic issue. Sounds like this person was waaaay off!

Just curious

[Anonymous]

The guy described in detail the cosmetic's of the train. then said that it was in working order for the operation.

 I think there is a problem with the ground. If I understand it correct the ground for the train is attached to the front coupler (black wire) that runs back underneath where the rollers attach to the truck. All the wires are attached and I don't see anywhere that the rubber coatng has come off. 

Whenever the front wheels are on the track it shorts out the entire line.

I did open her up yesterday and made sure that all the gears were lubed and that the engines actually turn.

[chuck]

There is an insulator in the power pickup assembly that may have disintegrated and is causing the short.   If you have access to an ohm meter/continuity checker, use the diagrams from the Olsen's Toy Train site to track back where the short may be occurring.  Short's usually occur on the "hot" side.  A broken return wire usually results in the tran not working at all, not shorting out.