industrial rail question

[Anonymous]

I know little about the differences between makers and their lines--I'm still pretty new.

My question is generated by recent discussion about their new line (Industrial Rail/Atlas O).  Are their new products filling a need (things not currently being made)  or are they more of the same--stuff already made by Lionel?  This is not a loaded question. The other thread had people disappointed by the road names, etc.  I simply would like to know more about the topic and why.  

Thanks for explaining the buzz around their new line for me.

In ignorance, I think all competition is good and any 0-27 stuff is good, but that's not a real informed opinion. 

 

Dan 

[Dr. John]

Dan,

Industrial Rails has been around for several years. It was produced by another company and recently purchased by Atlas O, which is expanding the line.

The IR line has offered good quality, O-27 rolling stock at a very reasonable cost. Cheaper than similar offerings by Lionel, K-Line or MTH.

As to whether they are producing items not being made - they are not copies of any particular item made by other companies. Their log cars and trolleys are somewhat unique offerings. Certainly a case could be made that other companies are producing box cars, hoppers, gondolas and tank cars, but IR has offered somewhat different variations and, again, the low cost has been a big plus, at least for me!

I think the buzz has as much to do with the fact that Atlas (more known for their scale line) has ventured into the O-27 market in a pretty big way, even offering a new IR steam engine, two transformers and a line of track. To me, that's good news for those of us who like O-27 equipment. 

[mpzpw3]

The Industrial Rail line used to be a cheap alternative to the other manufacturer's product, namely Lionel. At the time most Lionel starter rolling stock had molded in color (not painted), and plastic trucks and couplers. The Ind. Rail line had painted cars and die-cast trucks and couplers, at the same price-point as Lionel's starter rolling stock. They had quality paint jobs not currently available from Lionel at a good price.

In my opinion, this created a market that "forced" Lionel into painting their O-27 cars, and created K-lines Train 19 line, and MTH's rugged rails line. When Ind. Rail went out of business, the other manufacturer's let their "starter" car lines waiver, due to lack of competition. Atlas O has since picked up the line of Ind. Rail rolling stock, and began producing it again. They are in their first year of production, and considering their success in the O-gauge market, have determined that what they are producing will be profitable. I tend to agree. These are nice cars, and worth the price, especially for the beginner or the person looking to complete their fleet of Ind. Rail cars.

As far as modern roadnames go, again in my opinion, Atlas has marketing people, that have determined that the older roadnames will sell. I think when the line is established, more modern roadnames will come to market. Atlas has a little problem. They have bought tooling for rolling stock that was built to represent the 50's-70's. It's difficult in todays "prototypical" market, to justify producing these models in modern paint schemes (when was the last time you saw a boxcar in real train, much less a 2-bay hopper?).

I'll probably go for the Santa Fe work train set that Atlas recently announced, because I like the Ind. Rail cars, I consider Atlas a good company to continue the Ind. Rail line, and I like the Santa Fe. If someone prefers the BNSF, or Amtrack or something, they should voice their opinions to Atlas, and I'm sure with enough persuasion, they would make it.

I consider asking the manufacturer's to make modern trains with old tooling on the same level as those who ask them to make completely scale accurate models of some rare or obscure railroad. Everyone thinks that what they want has a market. I would like to see a complete line of Colorado Midland cars and engines, preferably scale, and cheap. Would You? Probably not. Paint masks are cheaper than tooling, I agree, but they do have be made, and that costs money. If selling PRR or Santa Fe cars make money, as a business, that's what I would do.

If the Industrial Rail line by Atlas makes money, I'm sure they will expand the line. Ind. Rail was known for quality. Atlas O is known for quality. If they make something you want buy it! Tell them what you want, and if enough people are interested, they will invest in it. That's business.

[Anonymous]

Guys,

I knew I came to the right place.  You two have given me an education on Industrial Rail.  thanks.  Your information will help me greatly going forward.  I'm not a scale guy, so I had better learn about IR and what is out there.  I have about seven scale Weaver cars I bought on the cheap, but although they are beautiful, I like the smaller "toy" size of O-27.  I'm happy IR is around if it forces the big boys to make more 0-27, too.  I know the scale market gets a lot of buzz, but the stuff is just too big for me--my opinion only. 

[brianel027]

Danrunner, mpz got it pretty much on the mark. I will add a couple of points.

The original Industrial Rail products made by United Model Distributors (a wholesale distribution company) came out in 1998. While K-Line and MTH answered that with their own Train-19 and Rugged Rails lines respectively, it took Lionel a number of years before they started painting starter rollinbg stock.... only in the last few years since they've been in China has Lionel painted (instead of using molded shell color) their low end starter cars.

Aside from quality, one advantage Industrial Rail products had which help make them a big hit, was UMD was a distribution company... a wholesaler. Industrial Rail products were available to nearly any dealer (unlike Lionel, MTH and K-Line in that order of difficulty of obtaining dealer status) and at very attractive wholesale prices that none of the others could match. So small dealers could stock Industiral Rail, sell it at a good discount and still make a good profit... something that cannot be done with Lionel.

Where the consumer got spoiled is when UMD dropped the Industrial Rail line and the remaining inventory was then blown out. At this point, Industrial Rail cars were commonly around $12-15 a pop. Many others tried them at this point. But their original street selling prices were closer to $20-$23. UMD was also smart enough (without initially telling anyone) to change the car numbers on rolling stock between successive production runs. Most UMD cars are available in at least 2 numbers and some of the older ones like the NYC Pacemaker are available in 3 and posasibly 4.

Atlas may have marketing people but obviously so did UMD. Their mix of old favorite roads with some new ones was also a winning formula. Look on eBay... the new roadnames sell just as good as the older ones.

At this point 7 years later, not one single company has issued a Norfolk Southern or BNSF box car in the 6464 imitation size like Industrial Rail. These cars sold well for UMD, so hopefully Atlas won't have to do too much market reseach to discover what UMD already figured out: there is a market for roads like CR, NS, BNSF, CPR, CNA, CSX on these sizes of cars.

The one drawback the Industrial Rail cars had, (and I don't know that Atlas has corrected this) is that they had a tight space inside the coupler when it was closed. This would cause some binding to happen between two coupled cars, especiallly on 027 curves, thus causing a derailment. This can be corrected by using a Dremel tool and a grinding bit and opening up the space a little bit inside the closed coupler.