I have read that this product has many uses in cleaning various items like E-units. Radio Shack is often referred to as a place to buy it. I purchased a can the other day however, I noticed that it is labeled cleaner & lubrication. Is this the same product and can it be used in the same way?
It's designed to clean most any electrical contacts.
underworld
I once was a sworn user of tuner cleaner.
As I've had more experience with it, I have to say that I now can not recommend it in any situation, especially the Radio Shack brand tuner cleaner.
Basically, what you get in the Radio Shack can is 1,1,1,2-tetrafluoroethane and a whole lot of mineral oil of medium viscosity. 1,1,1,2-tetrafluoroethane is commonly used as freon-replacement refrigerant. It is also an excellent volatile non-flammable organic solvent, both of which are very desirable properties in a solvent for electrical applications.
The problem is the mineral oil. When it's propelled out of the can by the tetrafluoroethane, it goes everywhere. Not only does it go everywhere, but it's fairly heavy molecular weight mineral oil that doesn't evaporate. This means that it stays where you put it. Besides impeding electrical contact, the mineral oil also attracts dust. This turns the oil into a gooey mess that ultimately causes more problems than it solves in the first place.
In short, I would definitely suggest that you not use TV tuner cleaner on your trains in any application.
Ben,
Probably why the article I read recently does not recommend using the cleaner & lubricant version. Unfortunately, this stuff is becoming hard to find. If thewre are any suggestions out there, let'em fly.
Now to return the can I have.
Mike
Mike,
Go to Lowes or Home Depot and get a can of CRC QD Contact Cleaner. It is plastic safe, evaporates quickly, and doesn't leave any oil or residue. It is also much cheaper and comes in a much bigger can than Radio Shack tuner cleaner. I used to use the RS tuner cleaner, but I no longer use it for the same reasons as Ben.
I bought the CRC cleaner Jim is talking about. No residue that I could detect. Paint thinner is another good cleaner for post war AC locomotives.
Jim
Modeling the Baltimore waterfront in HO scale
Never found the CRC at either HD or Lowes, probably looking in the wrong place. Someone let me know where to look and I'll do it.
Today I was in RS for something else when I saw a product called Velocity Dust Remover Spray (64-4351), picked it up and checked the contents; only has 1.1.1.2 - Tetrafluoroethane. I remembered that you guys commented that the RS stuff today was n/g because of the mineral oil added as a lube but the product with only the Tetra... would be okay. What do you think? 10oz can for about $7 with tax.
Mike, the new stuff sounds like what you need. As to Home Depot and the CRC, if you go down on the electrical isle, by where they have the terminals and assorted tools for electronics, the spray is usually down on a lower shelf. Blue and Red can. Just mentioning this as HD is probably cheaper than RS. They also have some terminal strips, shrink tubing, other assorted items that may come in handy.
Dennis
TCA#09-63805
Here's what I was using:
DeoxIT Contact Cleaner (Deoxit.com)
I bought this for Pro Audio electrical connections, mixer cleaning, and maintenance. 100% safe on plastics.
It works great, but it's expensive.
Kurt
Comments welcome.
The shrink tubing is used to cover exposed wire/connections. What you would do is to slip the tubing over the wire to be soldered, or connected. Then, once you have made the connection, you slide the tubing back over it and heat it with either a heat gun or with a match or lighter. It shrinks around the wire and connection. acts like electrical tape, only better.
ezmike wrote: Today I was in RS for something else when I saw a product called Velocity Dust Remover Spray (64-4351), picked it up and checked the contents; only has 1.1.1.2 - Tetrafluoroethane. I remembered that you guys commented that the RS stuff today was n/g because of the mineral oil added as a lube but the product with only the Tetra... would be okay. What do you think? 10oz can for about $7 with tax.
Do you see a spray when you push the button? This may be "air" in a can and the chemical is only a propellant. I use contact cleaner frequently at work. The best I have found is Tech Spray (brand) Blue Shower sold though electronic distributors.
Pete
Pete,
I'll check when I get home, if it is air, back it goes. Then I'll look for something else. Where would I find what you use? Do you have examples of store names? Thanks
Here is the MSDS:
http://rsk.imageg.net/graphics/uc/rsk/Support/MSDS/6404351_MSDS.pdf
I noticed in section 10 that it's "incompatible" with zinc.
Here is the Wikipedia entry for it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R-134a
It's not air; it's an "inert dusting gas", a refrigerant (R-134a) something like freon, with a "significant global warming potential" but an "insignificant ozone depletion potential ".
Bob Nelson
I use Deoixt too. I bought a small bottle of the 100% solution a few years ago. I use a Qtip to apply it, and remove the dirt.
Those spray type contact cleaners cannot be good for either our lungs, or the environment.
Bob,
That's interesting that it's listed as being reactive with zinc. Halocarbons tend to be, as a general rule, relatively inert. In fact, most are not flammable, and those which are generally burn with a sooty flame and are only in the presence of an open flame(they self-extinguish when the flame is removed). Thus, it's a bit surprising to me that 1-1-1-2-tetrafloroethane is listed as being reactive with those metals. I'll have to do some more research on that and find out what exactly is going on.
As for it possibly being a greenhouse gas, I've run the calculations myself and it most definitely is.
I've used the Radio Shack TV Tuner Cleaner for years and have not had any problems with it. I spray the cleaner on the commutator and lube the engine whenever I place a postwar engine on the layout. I am not aware of any detrimental affects due to the cleaner. My postwar engines run every bit as well as when they were new.
Earl
ben10ben wrote: That's interesting that it's listed as being reactive with zinc. Halocarbons tend to be, as a general rule, relatively inert. In fact, most are not flammable, and those which are generally burn with a sooty flame and are only in the presence of an open flame(they self-extinguish when the flame is removed). Thus, it's a bit surprising to me that 1-1-1-2-tetrafloroethane is listed as being reactive with those metals. I'll have to do some more research on that and find out what exactly is going on.
The fluorine in the halocarbons wants to bind very tighly with any free electrons while the metals in the 1st and 2nd columns of the periodic table want to give up (donate) electrons very easily (Zinc is in the 2nd column). There is a kit for bonding teflon (yes, teflon). The first step is to apply a special solution containing a colloidal suspension of metallic sodium to the surface of the teflon you want to bond. The metallic sodium literally rips the fluorine atoms from the teflon, leaving a brown carbon film that epoxy can adhere to after removing the etchant solution.
Daniel Lang
I use the 11oz can CRC QD Electronic Cleaner. Seems to work great for my use. No Residue. I purchase it at the local Do-It-Best hardware store. It's also sold at the local NAPA, but at a slightly higher cost.
This item can really remove the crud.
Rod LaFrance
Daniel,
Your explanation makes some sense, except that zinc is a transition metal located fairly far toward the right of the table(group 12) and not an alkali-earth metal(group 2) as you state.
In terms of metals, zinc is not particularly reactive. It's more so than iron, silver, copper, or gold, but less so that aluminum, magnesium, and a handful of less common metals.
Also, the fluorine in this particular compound has a full octet. In order for the zinc to react with the the fluorine, the zinc would need to give up electrons. There's no place for them to go on the fluorine atom, because, as I said, it already has a full octet.
I suspect that there is something else at play rather than just a simple reaction of zinc with the fluorine in the 1-1-1-2-tetrafluorethane.
ben10ben,
Picked up the CRC contact cleaner after reading this thread. Thanks! I always noticed the residue left from RS tuner cleaner. This just seems better. I will use it a bit and fully test it out.
Oh, it is underneath the connectors and stuff in the electrical isle at HD.
Mike S.
ben10ben wrote: Daniel,Your explanation makes some sense, except that zinc is a transition metal located fairly far toward the right of the table(group 12) and not an alkali-earth metal(group 2) as you state. In terms of metals, zinc is not particularly reactive. It's more so than iron, silver, copper, or gold, but less so that aluminum, magnesium, and a handful of less common metals. Also, the fluorine in this particular compound has a full octet. In order for the zinc to react with the the fluorine, the zinc would need to give up electrons. There's no place for them to go on the fluorine atom, because, as I said, it already has a full octet. I suspect that there is something else at play rather than just a simple reaction of zinc with the fluorine in the 1-1-1-2-tetrafluorethane.
I admit my recollection of zinc's location on the periodic table was faulty. Nevertheless, zinc gives up its electrons fairly easily as indicated on the table of electrochemical potentials:
http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/electrochemical.html
Finally, to say that the fluorine has a full octet is an oversimplification of things. The bond between the carbon and fluorine is partially ionic and partially covalent. The carbon exerts a strong attraction to the electron so even though electron spends most of the time around the fluorine atom, it still has to spend some of the time around the carbon atom. This provides the opening required for another electron to enter (e.g. from sodium).
Still, it is possible that some other chemical in the TV Tuner Cleaner may be reacting with the zinc.
.
c50truck wrote: I use the 11oz can CRC QD Electronic Cleaner. Seems to work great for my use. No Residue. I purchase it at the local Do-It-Best hardware store. It's also sold at the local NAPA, but at a slightly higher cost.This item can really remove the crud. Rod LaFrance
Rod,
That sounds great, but.... will it solve my problem? (Click link below)
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/1085009/ShowPost.aspx
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