CW-80 My final chapter

[Anonymous]

This morning I spoke with Lionel technical services (at least that's who I think it was.) Although I had written down my questions, the conversation quickly became so exasperating that I "lost it." They hung up on me. I apologize if I let the forum down, but I think I was provoked. For example, one question that they said they were "not permitted to answer" was how to pronounce the last name of Lionel CEO Jerry Calabrese. Honest.

I managed to learn just a little -- some of it dismaying. For example, the Owner's Manual that they sent me last week, along with a handwritten note that said "latest version," is actually dated January '04. If that is the latest, what is the one dated November 05? More to the point, where is one designed to explain how to hook up and operate the revised CW-80?

Here are the salient facts as I see them:

1) The CW-80 has undergone a major revision recently and quality control seems to be much better, although I don't have any real data to suport this latter assertion. It looks to me like complaints are down, and that is what two dealers have told me.

2) There are thousands of CW's out there which must be divided into two very different versions: those older ones that use posts A and B as "common;" and those newly-revised ones that use posts U and U as common, i.e. connected to an outside rail. Checking that the U posts are common (with an ohmmeter) is currently the only absolutely reliable way to distinguish between the new ones and the old ones. The tech folks would only say that a manufacturing date of "somewhere in 2006" signals a revised one, and would not comment on the "G" in the date code that we have observed.

3) If you connect your CW-80 to the track, and do not use the accessory posts, B and U, you will not see any problem with either the old or the new version. However, if you do want to use the accessory posts -- and they're fun -- you really want the revised version which should work right out of the box.  (If you have an older one, you have to employ a clumsy workaround. The workaround is NOT required if you have the revised version. Many, but not all, of the Notes and Cautions in the various manuals no longer apply either, although they do remain critical for the old version.) Doesn't that suggest that is important to be able to distinguish old from new? Lionel's service people seem to find the concept difficult to grasp.

4) The owner's manuals for virtually everything out there, starting with the CW itself and progressing through tubular track, FasTrack and the whole series of operating accessories and cars, are inconsistent, incomplete and just plain wrong in various parts. This has been particularly vexing for me, because it would have been nice to have been able to answer many questions simply by referring the owner to the manual. Far too often that just won't work. I have no idea when or even if they will be fixed.

5) If you have a CW-80, especially one of the new ones, and have a problem hooking it up, I suggest you start with your manual, then talk to your dealer, maybe post a question on a forum, and finally call Lionel. (Just be sure not to ask how to pronounce "Calabrese.")

6.) I have written a letter trying to call this to the attention of Mr. Calabrese. Frankly, I don't have much hope that he will ever see it, or that anyone with both PR and technical smarts will understand the significance of it. I did manage to keep it to a single page, but it is truly bare-bones as a result.

7. That is about all I can do. Thank you all for your recent outpouring of support on the other  thread. I have learned a whole lot more from you than I have been able to contribute, and wish you all the best. I believe that the revised CW-80 is now a good transfomer (a tad overpriced, perhaps) but until Lionel offers an easy way to distinguish between the excellent new ones and the old quirky ones; and publishes instructions that are appropriate for each of them (and the fun accessories) using a CW-80 to its full potential is going to remain something of a challenge. But it's possible to do, and worth the effort, IMHO.

Operating it without instuctions is a poor idea, because the CW-80 is extremely non-intuitive.  I shudder to think of all the kids whose first impression of Lionel trains will be disappointment  because dad can't make it run right due to faulty instructions. I mentioned this in my letter to Jerry C. Hope it helps.

I think that about does it for me. My very best to you all.

 

 

 

[dwiemer]

Wolverine, seems like you have it well thought out.  You have put much more effort into this than I ever thought of.  I did have a bad transformer with a Hobo set and they replaced it right away.  After that, I pretty much relegated the CW80 to Christmas set ups and occasional floor fun.  I have gone to the ZW and KW transformers for the large layout.  I applaud your efforts and hope that they do not fall on deaf ears.

Dennis

[johnandjulie13]

Wolverine:

You have truly performed true to your moniker.  Your tenacity should be applauded.  The unfortunate fact is that Lionel, MTH, LGB, Atlas and others really are small businesses.  A 1% net margin on sales of $60 million does not allow for significant overhead.  Hence, your customer service issues.

Having said this, I have observed (through the comments of other posters) that Lionel's performance and customer service have improved significantly under Calabrese.  While they have much farther to go, I am hopeful that they will continue the positive trend.  I hope you do get a response from the corporate office.  It will show that they understand the issues they are facing.  If Lionel is to fill their funnel, they cannot let purchasers suffer a bad first experience.

Keep running your trains and don't forget to check in from time to time.

Regards,

John O

[underworld]

Hopefully your letter to the top will at least see the eyes of someone who will act appropriately on it. I find that this seems to be more of a trend lately with many companies small and large. I have two jobs and one of the companies that I work for is like this. I think that some people in some companies believe that after a while people with legitimate concerns will just give up. This forum and other forums on this site are great....full of great information and people with great information. Best of luck in resolving your problem.

underworld

[ADCX Rob]

...the Owner's Manual that they sent me last week, along with a handwritten note that said "latest version," is actually dated January '04. If that is the latest, what is the one dated November 05?

 

I was wondering about that too since your earlier post on this.  I checked my PDF folder and found that I downloaded, renamed, & saved this manual(01/04) in April, 2004.  So much for "new".

Rob 

[dbaker48]

I think that about does it for me. My very best to you all.

Wolverine,

I hope that after all your work, and posting you still are not leaving this forum.  People like you
ARE the backbone, looking forward to your continued involvement!!!!!

 

[Anonymous]

ADCX Rob,

I totally blew that date. Evidently there is no recent update to the manual. My apologies. I have little patience with errors, and zero tolerence for my own. This is just one more reason I need to get away for a while. I have gone back and put an asterisk in my original post and corrected it. Hope I didn't mislead anyone.