Lionel 494 Beacon No spin

[trainbrain]

Hi

The beacon lights nice and bright and is trying to rotate but all that happens is just a good hum and a try to move.  Does this need a lil oil somewhere?  Thanx

[csxt30]

I put the dry, powdery graphite on the base of mine. Right where the beacon sits . Are you sure all the parts are there ? Needs to be a ring there that goes around the coil .

Thanks, John 

[trainbrain]

Thanks John-

I knew you'd reply because it was your advice I took and got one because the other heat driven beacons don't cut it. I just got it today.  The only ring I see is a rubber washer inside the beacon that's attached. Is this other ring loose or attached?  The base is solid with a  ring above the coil where the beacon sits.  The black covering over the coil is a lil bit torn.  Would this affect it?    Can this ring be at a parts dealer?

Thanks;

Brian

[csxt30]

Glad you goy it, now it looks like we have to figure out something on it to get it to work !! Sounds like the ring is missing that goes around the coil. Here's those pictures again of mine !! See if you have what I have !! Hard to explain !!

To the right of the lens below is the all important ring !! Mine is metal. Do you have one like that ?

 

Thanks, John

[trainbrain]

Here's all I have.  The beacon is one piece with the gray dome attached to the beacon.  Is there more I'm missing?  It looks a lil different than yours.  Thanks again- Brian

[dwiemer]

I have the "heat" version, so mine is different.  I did read in the "Tips and Tricks" book about how the other version works off of vibration.  The suggestion was to set the base near the tracks and to leave the mounting screws for the base slightly loose.  The idea is that the additional vibrations from the trains running would help the rotation of the light.  Hope it helps.

Dennis

[MartyE]

On the little rubber ring inside the lamp assembly, are the little rubber stubbles in good shape?  Even though the ring maybe there the stubbles need to be present as well to operate correctly.

[csxt30]

Brian, I'm not sure about yours. Looks like it's all there but maybe Olsens train repair site will show all the parts. Mine is the newer type, though. Also, mine works flawlessly all the time & at real low voltage settings, too. I wonder if you have a bad coil or something ? I hope not, but maybe we can get some more guys here to help !!

Thanks, John

 

  

[EIS2]

It looks to me like the rubber ring and the fibre ring that it rides on is missing.  The lens will not turn without them.

Earl

[martinden]

Try some powdered tephlon or graphite first. If that doesn't work, in all likelihood, the problem is a worn drive washer. Get a new one from a parts place (3520-16). Some have only three "feet," while others have six -- six is much better. They cost a buck or so, tho shipping drives that up. (Find some other parts to order at the same time.) If you have a local train store, you can probably get one there. Get the old washer out, stick the new washer in. Usually these old 494s have enough gunk in the beacon top to hold the washer still, but if not a bit of glue (just a bit) or some double-stick tape or almost anything will keep it stationary. (Though it probably doesn't matter, in my experience.)  BTW, no oil! 

There's actually not much of anything to not work -- if it vibrates, if the drive washer is OK, the thing goes around. That's about all there is to it. I have three of them -- they've all worked fine, except when I (once -- they last a looooong time!) wore out a drive washer.

[trainbrain]

Thanks everybody.  Marty- Could I apply lil rubber nubs myself?  I see 3 there but they are pretty worn.. This must be the problem, huh?

Thanks

[cnw1995]

Both the heat version and the vibration version have to be pretty level too.

[Anonymous]

The way this device works is that the motor imparts a random vibration. Specially-shaped nubs, of a certain consistency, have a designed-in "bias" that reacts to this randomness and converts it to a rotational motion. The little cattle and horse corrals, the baggage handling station, and several others work in a smilar fashion. It would be virtually impossible to fabricate a suitable substitute for the essential part, which does deteriorate with age and/or wear out.

Get the proper part, and make sure it is truly of recent manufacture, and not "new, old stock."

[martinden]

Not to be excessively difficult or argumentative, but I have investigated the idea that the beacon (vibrator type) has to be level to work, and it's just not so. At times. I've tried holding mine at a substantial angle, and they still operate. In fact, one of mine, right now, as I type, is going around beautifully while sitting at a (fairly modest) angle on my Christmas layout (yes, because I am a lazy slob who has just not even yet gotten around to leveling it!) The heat type may well be another story -- never have managed to get mine to rotate, level ot not.

Also, my beacons are postwar 494s; all later (modern-era) ones have a different design with a plastic top and a separate metal ring or bezel to cover the vibrator mechanism. (As shown in t photos upthread. They might well be sensitive to uprightness. I have a 2494 coming from an eBay auction. The 2494 was the very first MPC version, apparently with a tower identical to the 494, but with the revamped top. When it gets here, I'll see if it also works on a sloping surface.

 

[Anonymous]

martinden,

I, for one, always find your posts helpful. One of the ongoing problems with these forums is that folks frequently are not specific enough to allow others to identify what they are asking about. Lionel and others often make changes in their products without providing new labeling. Not knowing precisely what product is in question does not ordinarily enhance the quality of advice.

In addition, we as a group often try to answer questions without first going through a logical process of identification and "differential diagnosis." I know I have done it, try as I might not to do so.

All too often, it ends up being "the blind leading the lame and the halt," so to speak. It's amazing how frequently someone gets it right.

Feedback from the questioner as to whether and which advice proved useful certainly helps.

[lynbrookyankee]

I had similar problem with searchlight car - picked up new rubber ring at a train show & now it is rotates again. Part should be available from parts dealers or your local hobby shop.

[trainbrain]

Thanks again all.  I've got the ring on order.  The store mentioned adding a diode to boost the on/off surge that makes the vibration to spin the beacon.  I'll let you know in about a week!

[cnw1995]

Good point, wolverine.  My assumptions are based on my experiences with slightly different beacons --

[ADCX Rob]

The way this device works is that the motor imparts a random vibration... 

Not to be excessively difficult or argumentative myself, but the vibration of these accessories is far from random, it is determined by the frequency of the AC electric supply(60 Hz in USA).

Rob 

[Anonymous]

ADCX Rob,

Would you prefer "randomness of direction" of the vibration? The "motor" merely gets the table vibrating. The "built-in bias" of the little nubs converts this into a rotational motion. Would not an object without the special shape and calculated flexibility, such as a tiny ball bearing or a cube,  merely jump around a bit  -- in no particular direction?

These devices can seem quite mysterious to the uninitiated. Those who had one of those buzzing electric football games as a kid will likely understand because the little springy feet of the players are obviously flesible and springy. Those who have looked at the insides of the Animated Newstand or the Fork Lift accessory, where one can clearly see an obvious back-and-forth linear motion converted into rotation by a piece of string and a spring might well conclude it is magic. The origin of the rotation in a 494 beacon is probably the least obvious of all -- particularly to those who are familiar with the heat-and-vane mechanism of earlier versions that used the dimpled bulb.

For the purposes of this discussion, you pretty much have to know how it works to notice that an essential part is missing. The members did a very good job of diagnosing it, IMHO.

If you disagree, by all means go ahead and explain how it works.

 

[dwiemer]

Wolverine,

      I believe that CTT did a story on repair of the type of mechanisms you refer to in the recent past.  Your discription is on the mark as these devices are complex in their simplicity.  They do have that "randomness", but as you suggest, it is in a cyclical pattern and thus, the rotation seems constant.

Dennis

[martinden]

Thanks, wolverine. I reciprocate the sentiment, and find your posts useful, too. (With special attention to your ceaseless and tireless efforts to bring some rationality and systematic analysis to the endless discussions of the CW-80!)

There's a (non-train) forum I check in on every so often that has a "general questions" area, and they've put a sticky at the top of it: "If you have a question about your computer, read this first." There they have a list of things to check, and a list of anti-spyware programs, etc., that people can try to solve their problem(s). Then if someone wants to go ahead and post a computer question, the sticky suggests some relevant material to include in the first post: Type of computer, browser and version, what occurs, under what circumstances, what have you tried, etc., thus generally getting the discussion off on the right foot. Maybe something like that would be useful here.