Thoughts on Operating Conventional Engines with New ZW and Cab1 Command Control

[jimhaleyscomet]

About two weeks ago all of you helped me decide to order a new Lionel ZW to help run my conventional units via remote control (cab1).  For my conditions it seemed the best route to take (over a powermaster or TPC unit)  I had been using DCS except with a minimum starting voltage of 5 volts and some engines tended to take off too fast.  I recieved my new ZW today and here are my observations.

1.  Starting voltage seems lower.  I set the ZW handles to run at the fastest speed I want (about 1/2) throttle.  It works great!  According to the manual that also increases my speed step "resolution" as it takes the maximum handle voltage as set and divides by the number of available speed steps (34,56 or 96).  Low speed control of my Williams engine is great. 
2.  I am going to use the "set stall voltage" feature so I do not accidently reverse engines when I throttle down.  This was also a problem on my DCS but I never found a fix (perhaps one exists). 

All in all I think it is a wonderful package for running conventional  I will let you know again as I learn more.  Thank you again for all your help with my decision to take the plunge with a new ZW.

Jim H

[mpzpw3]

I know I was a little amazed when I finally went with the new ZW and command control for my conventional engines. My layout is flat, with scenery being used to to create the illusion of grades and I thought I wouldn't be all that impressed having a hand-held remote. It's nice to be able to blow the horn and bell from anywhere with the handheld, and also enjoy the brake/boost feature. Also, with the addition of a SC-1 controller, I can now throw 4 switches through the remote. If I could just figure out how to turn a block on and off, I wouldn't need to go to my control panel at all except to turn on the main power.

I was not aware that the stall feature could be used with non-command loco.'s. Look like I need to re-read the instructions. One thing about the new ZW, you have to read the instructions!!

[okiechoochoo]

I am considering going this ways also.  What all do you need.  The new ZW and a Cab 1 only.  Does the ZW receive a signal from the Cab 1 to control voltage to the track or what.  I am confused here.  How about an explanation.  I have no Lionel shops in my city to go look at this stuff.  Thanks

 

[Roger Bielen]

To use the CAB-1 I believe you'll also need a base station since it is the reciever for the signal from the CAB-1 and then "talks" to the ZW controller.

 I just wired one up today for someone and that's the hardware we used.  He will be using TMCC but also wants conventional capability.  The layout has two independent loops that he wants on different "channels".  I wired one to channel A and the other to D.  This way you set the ZW handles to the max. voltage you want, address the channel, in the case TR 1, or 4 crank up the CAB-1 to raise the voltage, this will give conventional control, or for TMCC when max. voltage is reached address the engine, ENG 1, and run in TMCC.

[chuck]

The only devices that can can receive signals direct from the CAB-1 are the original PowerMasters (they pre-date the Command Base, TMCC was "phased in" over the course of a year) and the Command Base.  All other devices get theire commands from the Command Base by way of the track carried radio signal or by way of the Command Base serial communications port.

 

[jimhaleyscomet]

Here is a simplistic answer to the question of what do I need to operate Conventional and TMCC engines remotely. 

New ZW
Cab1 Remote
Command Base
One or two multiprong power strips ($10). 

p.s. The Cab1 and Command Base are usally sold together for about $100.  The ZW is closer to $360. 

[msacco]

Jimhaleyscomet,
I also didn't know about getting finer control with the handles not set to max. I use this feature for kids thus far.

   Now I have an older zw that has only now seen use after being boxed for more than a few years. I have the two 135brick postwar celebration version which was the first I believe.

   I looked over my manual really carefully and can't find it. What page is it on? I know you can use momentum to change speed steps by selecting the channel and using low, med, high to change speed steps on an individual channels. I use that all the time.

  And yeah, the stall feature is great in conventional. Keeps the enit from cycling when using block control.

  Love the new ZW.

 

Mike S.

[jimhaleyscomet]

Page 9 of the manual I downloaded yesterday from the lionel site is as follows:

NOTE:
The CAB-1 Remote Controller will not be able to increase the voltage past the level designated by the handle positions. For FULL power, set the handles all the way forward.
The speed steps will be compressed into the voltage ranges you set. For example, if you set
the throttle to half power, the value of each speed step will be cut in half. The number of
speed steps never changes during normal operation. Refer to Table 2 on page 11.

I believe copying this small section for educational purposes falls under the copywrite "fair use" law. 

Jim H

[jimhaleyscomet]

I finally got a chance to run all my conventional K-line/Williams/Lioenl engines with the newZW/ Cab 1/ command base control (all running through DCS fixed voltage ports).  The results are as follows:

K-line "speed demon" switchers (from modern sets).  Great slow speed operation when set handle at 1/2.
Lionel Postwar turbine and army switcher.  Great operation across the board.
MPC/Modern can motor Lionel F3 AA units.  Great operation across the board.  Much better slow speed operation control than MTH DCS.
Beeps.  Great operation.
Williams conventional Dash 9 and SD90.  Great operation.
Modern lionel 4-4-2 steam engines (from starter sets).  Great slow speed operation!

As you can see, I think for walk around slow speed operation of conventional locomotives a new ZW/Cab1/ command base is SUPER!  Once I added a "sound" car it was almost as good as command control.

Jim H