Making the grade

[dochooter]

I am planning a layout and was thinking of putting in a 2% grade.  Will the average train go up and down it with out me having to monitor the throttle?  I usually like to simply let the trains run.  I have never used a grade before.

Thanks

jh

[randyaj]

There are a lot of variables to consider in your question.  Length of trains, number of engines, quality of engines, grades on curves etc.  If your train is short(less than 20 cars)  and the curves are broad (more than 30" in HO) you should see little difference in speed between uphill and downhill.  If your trains are longer than 20 either increasing number of engines or decreasing the grade will help.  If you have sharp curves this will increase the problem as the force required to pull a train up a curved grade in much greater than in a straight line.

hope this helps

Randy

[Buckeye Riveter]

I am planning a layout and was thinking of putting in a 2% grade.  Will the average train go up and down it with out me having to monitor the throttle?  I usually like to simply let the trains run.  I have never used a grade before.

Thanks

jh

My Lionel Rio Grande 222 Single Motor (circa 1962) will not go up a 2% grade without me increasing the power to the track.  It also can become a run away when heading down the grade.  My newer non-cruise control locomotives can negotiate the grade, not a constant speed, but satisfactorily.  Of course, the cruise controled locomotives don't even know there is a grade.

See ya down the tracks,

[luther_stanton]

I have a 2.5% grade through a curve.  A Lionel GP-9 or Berkshire Jr with 4 - 7 cars needs throttle adjustments.  Anything with Odyssey or Train America's EOB will maintain a constant speed.  My Hudson with Odyssey speeds up down grade for just a small bit until the electronics "catch it" and make an adjustment.

[lionelsoni]

Of locomotives without speed controls, those with permanent-magnet DC ("can") motors will generally have better speed regulation than those with universal motors.

[dochooter]

Maybe I should consider 1%.  The grade would be to just add some variety.  The engines are around 5 year old MTH ie SD90MAC, Cab forward steam engine.  I would like to run very long trains on the loop though.  Maybe not worth it.  The actual grade will be on straights but will still be pulling cars through a turn before it.

[msacco]

I run a 4% traditional Lionel trestle grade. Of course I cannot just let the trains run, but I do have a different block on the down and up attached to a different voltage feed.so the train will travel safely over the whole loop without me doing a thing.

Mike S.

[otftch]

I don"t know the percent but I use one inch in three feet for my grades.I find most locos with a good sized train will run up and down with no throtle adjustments.They go down a litle faster but not enough to derail at a curve at the end.Loco's with speed control don"t even notice it.

                                               Ed

[fifedog]

Hey Hooter, on my 9 x 6 O-gauge layout, I use O-42 Kline track and make my engines climb 5 1/2 inches to cross over itself on an extended figure eight.  Most of our fleet is MTH Proto 2.0, and nothing has a problem overcoming the steep grade, and there is minimal speed change due to the speed control inside the engines.  Traditional Lionel can't hack it.  Williams engines can, but do pick up considerable momentum down grade.

[chuck]

A 2% grade shouldn't be too much of a problem.  A bigger questions is why are you putting in a grade?  Multilevel layouts are visually more intersting but it is often easier to just run seperate loops of track at different elevations.  Grades take up space and reasonable grades take up a lot of space.  When you are measuing elevation differences remember to measure from the bottom of the ties on the lower track to the bottom of whatever structure you are placing the overpass trucks on.   While the clearance you are worried about is top of rail on the lower track to the bottom of whatever you are trying to clear, unless you lower the bottom tracks, total grade elevation needs to account for the track height as well.

[dochooter]

I was just going to make a grade for visual interest.   Still tinkinering with plans.  The layout will also have loops at different levels as well.

 

ps, I used to live in Dearborn, MI.

[Geno]

I'm building a two-level layout as well, and am using a 3% percent grade transition between levels. It is a bit extreme, but all of my engines are the modern varitey (vertical twin- can motors, rubber tires, heavy) so I doubt they'll have any problems pulling up the grade. I also run double and triple lash-ups, so low speed pulling power is no problem.

If your engines are the older type (MPC w/ single pullmor motors) or an engine from a starter set, you may have problems going up even a 2% grade.

Geno

[chuck]

Another issue with steep grades are coupler failures, particularly on longer trains.  A coupler that works fine on the level may startt to act up when subjected to the additional forces involved in transiting a grade.  I had a 6% grade on a layout I was working and found that not only did some loco's have trouble, I had a number of breakway/run aways on trains trying to climb that grade.

[dochooter]

I don't think it is worth it to add the grade.  I have all of the track layed out on the floor and have been toying with different ideas.  I did find away to add another level  which will add a lot more visual interest as well as another train. 

Originally, I was hoping to have some larger open landscaped areas but I have so many buildings and accesories that I will need significant flat areas where there aren't mountains.