Signals and Signal bridges

[cheech]

i have an assortment of mainline signals .... some lionel, some mth/railking, kline and atlas. They all have different connection strategies all leading
mr. novice here to ask a couple of questions.

1. must the Atlas products use the control board and 'telphone jack' method of connectivity or can it be cut off and connected like the other manufacturers into 153 connectors or conversely, can the others be adapted to the Atlas board/Jack method?

2. Lionel and Mth suggest use of the 153C or the 153 Infrared lockon. Would some use of Relay's be more practical? What kind?

I planned to power these items with a separate supply driving a bus that runs around the layout.

If i used the 153IC, I would install the board under the layout and not tie up space with the " large house" next to the tracks as was described in a post late last year.

Has anyone found a simple way to connect these items

thanks in advance

ralph

[phillyreading]

For signal lights I use an insulted piece of track to activate the light bulbs, I am using GarGraves brand track so all rails are insulated from the factory. The way I do it is to use the outside rail as a neutral or ground for the system and use insulated track pins and supply a hot wire straight to the signal light, also you can put a switch in to cut off power to the signal light when not needed.
Lee

[Roger Bielen]

[#ditto], but I don't know a thing about the Atlas system. I've also used the Z-Stuff relays in conjunction with the switch machines for switch position indication. The relays don't have to be mounted onto the machines, they can be under the layout.

[lionelsoni]

Here is how to wire a red-green signal to operate directly from the track:

Wire the two lamps in series if they are not already wired that way. (They usually are: terminal---red lamp---common terminal---green lamp---terminal.) Connect the red terminal to the supply, whether the track center rail or a separate accessory voltage. Connect the green terminal to ground, that is, the non-isolated outside rail. Connect the common terminal to the isolated outside rail. Get an additional lamp and wire it across the red lamp. Hide it somewhere where it can't be seen or cover it with shrink tubing. This extra lamp should be suitable for the voltage you are using and preferably draw rather more current than the signal lamps. If necessary, add multiple smaller lamps in parallel until the red signal stays off when the track is unoccupied.

The way this works is that, when the track is unoccupied, current flows through both lamps; but the extra lamp shunts most of the current around the red lamp, turning it off and presenting a low resistance to the green lamp, which lights brightly. When the track is occupied, the train shorts out the green lamp, turning it off and presenting the full voltage to the red lamp, which lights regardless of being shunted by the extra lamp.

You could use a resistor in place of the extra lamp, but it doesn't work nearly as well. The lamp's resistance drops substantially with reduced voltage, making it a much more effective shunt. A resistor low enough in resistance to keep the red lamp dimmed out will draw much more current when the red lamp is lit, because its resistance does not increase with voltage the way a lamp's resistance does.

If you have some other lighted accessory that would be appropriate to light when the train is in the block, you can wire it across the red lamp to replace or supplement the hidden lamp.

[cheech]

thanks bob, i'll give it a try.

ralph

[lionelsoni]

I notice that your topic is "Signals and Signal bridges". Signal bridges with two signals could be a problem using my trick, since the common terminal probably is the same for both signals. If you have any like this, I'm afraid you would have to insulate the signal heads from each other, which could be difficult if the common is the metal bridge structure.

[Anonymous]

I use relays activated by an outside insulated rail. For a block signal a power lead would go to the common contact. The red bulb would go to the NO (normally open) contact and the green bulb would go to the NC (normally closed) contact. The other power lead would go to the common of the block signal. Virtually any trackside accessory, gateman,crossing gates,ect can be operated by this method and wired to a sperate transformer.. When wiring a new layout you can divide the loop into segments insulating outside rails in convienient sections. Run all the wires to a terminal block.Use the individual wires to power a relay coil where you want something to activate. The other wires where realys are not used can go to the transformer common. Later if you want to add something you can simply hook up a relay and wire the accessory.

Dale Hz

[cribs1]

Relays will work, but the Atlas system uses a PCB off the insulated rail.  It works the same way without all the noise and chatter.  Custom Signals.com uses the Atlas system and takes it further with Absolute Permissive Block Signaling.  Now you can have the turnouts give you all the prototypical aspects on all the signals at a junction.  The signals look great too.