FYI - Incompatiblity of glue and tapes used by Lionel and K-Line

[Buckeye Riveter]

As many of you know, from time to time I have taken locomotives apart and I am seeing something interesting concerning glues and tapes. On both my Lionels and K-Line I have found instances where the smoke fluid has interacted with the glue or tape and the adhesive bond has deteriorated.

Lionel uses two sided tape to hold wires in place. The two sided tape's adhesion was gone when I removed the shell. Lionel used a small piece of foam with the sticky side attached to the shell at the exhaust port. The smoke fluid had disolved the glue holding the foam in the correct place. On the K-Line again several wires were secured by two sided tape and the adhesive had been disolved. .

Since my neighbor is a salesman for the 3M Company, he has told me that 3M has just the tapes and adhesives they need to use for these engines. It is obvious to me that the designers at Lionel and K-Line didn't do their homework and testing before they put these tapes and glues in the locomotives.

Has anybody else seen this when you pop off an engine shell? How about other brands?

[thor]

Yes! In fact it was one of the first things I noticed when I took my engine apart (unnecessarily) just to see how it worked, you know how that goes. There was a piece of black adhesive tape formed into a tube that had come unrolled, my best guess was it had been somewhere close to the smoke unit, at first I thought it was a crude bridge to fill a gap between the body shell chimney and the smoke units output.

Wherever it was, it hasnt been missed. It might only be something to aid in production and not really needed in the model. If it had been, I'd have substituted heat shrink or some small piece of plastic tubing cut spirally so it could be put onto the wires without unsoldering.

[Jumijo]

A few weeks back, I was cleaning the wheels of my Polar Express Berkshire locomotive. I noticed 2 small, clear plastic strips hanging down from inside the shell. They were hanging down far enough to touch the left front drive wheel. I just carefully slid them back up inside. What the heck were those?

Jim

[Anonymous]

I've noticed this too...especially in steamers. I honestly think that the manufacturers use these items (two sided tape and stick-on wire clips) to help them route wires during the assembly process, and don't care if they come dislodged at some later date.

[ChiefEagles]

All the time. In fact, I recommend everyone replace their gaskets at the exhaust with the closed cell foam insulation [with one side sticky] found at Ace and others. With the right thickness, it will give you a better seal. The smoke fluid will eventually make the glue on this turn aloose. Its so cheap, I just cut a new piece each time I service a locomotive. This tighter seal will help keep the fluid away from the other parts of the engine [not perfect but a better job]. Also helps direct smoke out the exhaust better.

[wrmcclellan]

Buckeye - I have seen the same thing on all my locos. Did your 3-M buddy tell you the name of the improved products for this application and are they available commercially?

Roy

[FJ and G]

Chief,

Great tip! But still, Buckeye's question is, why didn't the manufacturers do it right to begin with? After all, they aren't Johnny's come lately. They must have seen what locos look like inside after being in business for decades. I'd imagine too that doing it right the first time would improve the bottom line by reducing service calls? (unless that is, there is no extended warranty offered; then the service calls would generate profits) :-)

[Anonymous]

Yeah

MTH on Proto 1 engines sticks the lighting circuit right to the metal chasis. The tape gets hot and melts and the board shorts against the frame ruining the board and sometimes taking other components with it.

Dale Hz