Trains slowing down ??

[Anonymous]

I have noticed after recently connecting a 145 gateman to an insulated section of track (there is also a crossing gate connected to this section) that my trains slow down in this area. They speed back up when they clear the block that contains this insulated section. I have not had this issue with other insulated sections.

Anyone got any ideas?

Thank you

[pbjwilson]

The two accessories you are running are taking power away from the train. What kind of transformer are you using?

[Sturgeon-Phish]

What may be causing the slow down is the power on the insulated part of the track going through the accessory may not be seeing the same voltage/current that the uninsulated portions have. A voltage drop in the insulated portion would be more noticable at lower speeds (voltage). I see a similar slow down where my cow on the track and sam the semaphore is located, I figure because the base rail wire provided by the accesory is a lot smaller in gage than the rest of the track.
Jim

[Anonymous]

I am powering the accessories separate from track power by using the C post on a PW ZW. I have kept wiring gage consistent at 14 instead of using smaller wire for accessories.

[lionelsoni]

Two things might be going on:

Even though one side of the accessory is connected through its own wire back to the transformer, the other side is connected from the insulated control rail through the train's axles to the uninsulated outside rail and then back to the transformer common through the track. The current flowing in the track raises the outside-rail voltage, which reduces the voltage between the outside and center rails. This voltage reduction may be sufficient to slow the train noticeably. A feeder to the outside rails near the accessory should help.

Loading any output of a multiple-output transformer will lower the voltage at all the outputs, not just the one loaded. This happens because they share all of the primary winding and usually a significant part of the secondary winding. So any voltage drop due to the increased current through the impedance of these windings shows up in all the outputs. Using a separate transformer for the accessory will eliminate this effect.

Another thought: I have often said that the frequently advised practice of "phasing" accessory transformers is useless, but also harmless. However, in this case, actually arranging a separate accessory transformer to be out of phase with the track transformer would cause the voltage change due to accessory current returning through the track to boost the track voltage rather than lower it. If a slight speedup is acceptable, this way of using a separate transformer could kill two birds with one stone and save having to add a feeder.

[Anonymous]

Thanks all. I will try adding a feeder to the outside rails in this area. I thought I had put plenty of feeders in though. There are outside rail feeders no more than 2-3 feet away on either side of this particular section. The gateman accessory has one black common returning to the ZW directly and the other is tied to the insulated section. As mentioned power comes from the C post on the ZW. If that sheds more light on the subject.

[lionelsoni]

Dru, that is the way I understood the situation.

[Anonymous]

Ok Thanks Bob.

[martinden]

I don't like the light to dim when the man comes out, so I use two transformers for my gateman (in addition to the one powering the train). Also, the gateman I normally use (I have several) needs a fairly high voltage for the solenoid, and I want the light to run at a lower voltage. It's not hard to wire it this way, though I don't have a handy diagram of the connections.

[lionelsoni]

By the way, lest anyone think that prototype gatemen are obsolete, we have one here, complete with a little house, at McNeil, TX, guarding a crossing for the Austin White Lime Company.

[1688torpedo]

Now we know what Jim Duda's Moonlighting Job is.[;)][:P][:)] Now Lionel will have to fix a Beard to its Gateman & include a box of Grits at the door if it comes back out with the Gateman again! [;)][:)]

[Anonymous]

OK. Took wires off gateman. Train still slowed down. Wired in common outside rail feeder to track section adjacent to insulated section. Trains still slowed down. Interesting, this is much more noticeable when train is running at slower speed to begin with. I guess next step is to wire in another center rail feeder and after that, ...... buy an additional transformer???

[laz 57]

DKVT87,
This might sound funny but did you add more lockons to your layout?
More feeders coming from transformer will better distribute power to all parts of the track.
Hope this helps?
laz57

[Anonymous]

Laz - no lock-ons, all soldered connections. As you suggest thought there are feeders about every 3 feet of track. I would think I had plenty but I have put in an additional set near where this insulated section is located. I will keep experimenting and see what happens.

[laz 57]

Very interesting DVKT87, keep us posted, it is a ponder?
laz57

[Anonymous]

OK.......final answer seems to be adding the feeders (red and black) to this area. This particular section is located in a block that has a switch in the middle of it. The switch is not powered from track power and the existing red (pwr) feeder in the block was on the far side of the switch (straight through portion). The curved (turnout) portion of the switch has a insulating pin in the center to permit isolation the straight through portion as part of the block. Adding another black feeder to the outside rail did not resolve the issue. When the red one was soldered in to the center rail.......no slow down. Thanks for the assistance all.

[laz 57]

DKVT87,
Glad to here you figured it out.
And all is running well.
laz57