Please help me design an 8 X 8 layout

[Anonymous]

Newbie hear with permission from the wife to have an 8 X 8 table in our basement. I would like to have a layout with 2 loops that are connected and that have sidings plus an elevated loop. This layout will also have TMCC and use Fastrack since I have 2 starter lionel sets that came with fastrack.

Would someone with some experience tell me the best radius track to use as I probably can't go no wider than O36.

Thanks

[Dave Farquhar]

8x8 is wide enough that you can go O42 or even O54 for an outer loop. My layout is 8x8 and I went with an O42 outer loop and an inner loop of Marx O34 (which is close to Fastrack O36). If it hadn't been for where I wanted to position my switches, I probably could have done O54. With tubular track, a loop of O54, extended with the Lionel long straight sections, fits pretty nicely on an 8x8. Depending on the length of the Fastrack long straights, the same should be true for that type of track.

O36 isn't bad but my engines (mostly O27 minimum radius) do run more nicely on O42 and probably would do even better on O54.

While 8x8 isn't as large as most of the layouts featured in the magazines, it's big enough to let you do a lot, and to most wives, 8x8 seems huge, so it seems to be a pretty good size to work with. It's also small enough that it won't take years for it to end up looking like something, which is also an important consideration.

[Anonymous]

It really depends on what you want to do. If you want sidings and more varied operations you may want to stay with 036 as it will let you fit more in to the space. If you want to watch scale cars glide around wide radius curves, go with 084 then 072 then 060 loops.

What sets do you have?

[dwiemer]

Two things, first check the other posts as I know someone has posted a website with different layouts and ideas. Also, one of the best designers was a guy named Armstrong, you can look his name up in Amazon, there are a few books with his plans. You don't have to use an entire plan, but can adapt different portions. A lot of what goes into your layout depends on what you want, Do you want passenger trains, freight, coal, cattle, milk cars, etc. Then you should decide if you want "Point to point, dogbone, etc". Do some research and subscribe to a magazine such as CTT for ideas. You can start with a simple two loop with cross over and a branch and then expand. Another idea is to get the software, ie: RRtrax or another to plan your layout. Just as much energy should go into planning as building your layout. You want to be happy with it and not get bored anytime soon.
Dennis

[Anonymous]

Check out this site for track plans, http://www.thortrains.net/ to get some ideas. I think CCT has a track plan book available too.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all the input guys.

I have two sets, Sante Fast Freight and the Black Diamond Freight. I beleive the Black Diamond set comes with O-48 and the Sante Fe comes with O-36.

Question: Can I buy the MTH Layout program seperately or do I have to buy a set from MTH? I'm looking for an easy to use program to help me design a layout.

[Anonymous]

I used the MTH software, found it very helpful, but not quite accurate. Bought Dremel tool since I had several track to cut. I would maximize your track diameter, 8 feet is 96 inches, and a 72" circle works well especially if you are planing to run two levels. I do not beleive you have sufficient track length to stay under a 4% grade to have the two tracks merge and then change elevation. For switches, I used 022 and also 72 diamter, the latter look more authentic.

[Brutus]

I think you could easily join the first and second levels. a 72 inch diameter circle = about 226 inches in circumference, so at a 4 percent rise, you could go up about 9 and 3/64 inches in one circle, right?

I just got the RR Tracks software for CHRISTmas and it seems great, although I haven't had much time to play with it.

[Anonymous]

I'm playing around with an 8 x 9 and figuring out how to get a climb into it. The current layout is dogbone, with one loop on a 5 x 9 connected to another on a 3 x 9. I plan on 1/2 in per foot rise, so 6" elevation will require 144" of track to climb. Ergo, climbing will require curves and loop back on an 8 x 8. Then, another 144" to return, or a loop back on top. Running the straight section diagonally across the table will yield about 6" more than running parallel to the edge. And you gain another 12" to climb with the additional curved half sections to provide the diagonal versus straight 180 degree loops.
So far I'm trying to fit in a W (an S attached at top to a backward S) in the middle of the layout. Think of a horseshoe with straight sections angled \ / toward each other at bottom topped by a curved loop more than 180 degrees. The bottom adds curved loops to connect to the ground level track. The dogbone outer curve on the 3 x 9 is broadened with straight sections and uses a couple of inches of the 5 x 9 to enable the climbing curve to fit inside of it. The interior leg of that dogbone will pass under the elevated section. Hopefully 6" less 3/8" for roadbed provides enough clearance to that track.
All track is Lionel 031 tubular, with a few pieces of 072 on the 5 x 9.
In my case, there is no loop that is totally elevated, so whatever goes up must come down.[?]

[Anonymous]

The MTH software comes free with a set and it's probably available separately. But it won't be much if any help with fastrack!

RRTrack ware works great. I find it essential for planning anything beyond a simple loop. Fastrack has little no margin of error or fudge factor. It would be very difficult to cut.

www.rrtrack.com

I think your going to have some trouble fitting everything you mentioned in 8x8, but a track planning tool will help you fit in as much as possible.

I did pretty well just messing around. Drop me a line and I'll email you a layout.

Old 2037

[poppyl]

Two suggestions -- if you plan on sticking with one level you can accomodate O54 and O45 curves mains within your available space. I would suggest that you run a figure eight off your inner main so that you will be able to reverse trains. You can put crossover switches between the inner and outer on the two sides not involved with the figure eight.

If you want to go to a second level, use the former outer main as your incline track. For a 3% grade up to six inches in height you'll need 200 inches of track. To get seven inches of height you'll need 235 inches of running track. A steeper grade means less track run required. Your inner main can then tunnel under your second level. You can set up your elevated line as a big reversing loop and then you will only need one reverse loop off your lower main.

Poppyl

[Anonymous]

Old 2037 actually designed a great layout for me using the RRTrack software. It had everything I needed and everything I was hoping to accomplish.

I would like to personaly thank Old 2037 and everyone else who replied to my post and gave suggestions. Whenever I get the layout done I'll post pics for everyone to see.

Thanks again.

[Anonymous]

I hope one of you will post the layout diagram on this forum.

[otftch]

One way of solving the grade problem is to lower one track while you raise the other.If you use a jig saw and cut along both outside edges of your track you can lower it easily.If you drop down two inches that means you can take away two inches on your rise.You can use the jig saw to cut here also.
Ed

[Anonymous]

BION, one of the great places to see a drop and rise is the NYC subway. All done in tunnel below ground. The IND line is 4 track between 59th and 125th Sts. All stops in between are local and the stations are one atop the other, uptown on bottom. To get the locals one above the other, the uptown local crosses over its express neighbor. This is accomplished by dropping the express first, 2 levels down, bringing the local across it, then raising the express to its level. To see it:
First, you take the A train at 59th to a little spot that's known as Harlem. Look through the windows to get accustomed to the low light of the tunnel and you will be rewarded as you get uptown. This is also one of the longest express runs on the subway with no curves and sometimes the hogger leans on the throttle.

[Locomotive681]

QUOTE: Originally posted by grumpy4

BION, one of the great places to see a drop and rise is the NYC subway. All done in tunnel below ground. The IND line is 4 track between 59th and 125th Sts. All stops in between are local and the stations are one atop the other, uptown on bottom. To get the locals one above the other, the uptown local crosses over its express neighbor. This is accomplished by dropping the express first, 2 levels down, bringing the local across it, then raising the express to its level. To see it:
First, you take the A train at 59th to a little spot that's known as Harlem. Look through the windows to get accustomed to the low light of the tunnel and you will be rewarded as you get uptown. This is also one of the longest express runs on the subway with no curves and sometimes the hogger leans on the throttle.

[#ditto]

[tjsprague]

Here's a quick design I did on RRTrack to an 8' x 8' space.

An elevated section could be added, but would probably have to be a separate loop.



I don't have the FastTrack library, but I made this with Atlas 036 curves and turnouts.

Let me know if you want more information on it.

Good luck,

Tim

[Anonymous]

Great diagram. Adding a reversing connection to the inner loop from the top to the bottom w 2 more switches would be interesting. Just requires the spur from the right side to be layed differently than shown. One switch connection could be on the outer loop by using a crossover with the inner loop. A 3rd train could be parked on the connector while the outer loops are in use. When one is sent to the yards the 3rd could take its place.