Lionel RS3 Engine Weight/Traction

[Anonymous]

I just picked up a 1997 Lionel RS3 (Rio Grande paint) that I want to use for switching. Problem is, this thing is spinning the wheels with just six cars behind it. Anyone got any clues for getting more traction out of this engine? Where do I add weight and what should I use for that purpose? Two rolls of nickels rubberbanded to the stamped handrails made some difference, but put the center of gravity WAY up high. Not much room inside the shell. Planning on repainting this one, so I could use some pointers on taking it down to the chassis as well. Thanks in advance...

[lionelsoni]

I have a stock of (erstwhile) stick-on lead strips for tire balancing that I got at a garage sale. These can be cut and bent to fit what space you may have. (Is there room in the fuel tank?) You can find thin lead sheets in hobby stores also.

When I have plenty of room, it amuses me to use prototype spikes for weights, not that that would help with your problem.

[FJ and G]

railmail,

Exact same same happened to me w/a cheapy Lionel RS-3 one-motored jobby.

I added weights. You'll need to experiment a bit because where you add them is important. I filled up 2 film cannisters w/nuts and bolts for mine.

Also, the screws easily strip out of the plastic and the wires are a mess to tuck inside the shell.

GOOD LUCK!

[lionelsoni]

If it has one motor, get the weight over that motor as much as possible. It also helps to run with the powered truck in the rear, so that the weight transfer when pulling adds weight to it.

[Anonymous]

Nope, its dual motored, which is why I was surprised at how low-performance is. But it is light, about 1/2 to 2/3 the weight of a Williams GP7. I already took it apart once to see if I could fit the weight in; with the fuel tank mounted to the bottom, there is very little room underneath for weight along the frame, and Im worried about truck clearance (042 min) if I get too close to them. FJ&G - where did you fit the film cans in? I reaaly like the looks, but maybe I should send this one packing; I've only got $90.00 in it and it is LN...

[lionelsoni]

Can't you get some lead into the fuel tank?

[Chris F]

Somethin' ain't right, here!

Lionel service manual Supplement 27 (1994), shows RS-3's have lead weights in the fuel tank area, P/N 610-8805-559.

I just got a 2004 Midwest Freight set with a cheapy (single-motor, plastic frame) RS-3. This loco contains a fuel tank weight, but it is secured with a screw into a tank that is shaped a bit differently than shown in the supplement. My loco also has another, smaller weight over the powered truck. Weight of this loco is 1 pound, 13.75 ounces (plus the weight of six screws[;)]).

There's still some room in the fuel tank area for additional lead weights, as well as room at the front and rear below the hood. Granted, your 18845 loco may be different, but it should be worth another look.[:)]

My spare lead weights came from discarded draperies. Fishing line weights are another alternative. Maybe you got a good deal on your loco because the previous owner didn't know where to source lead weights?[swg]

[Anonymous]

I'll take it apart again tonight, but it looked really tight inside. It looks like the electronics for the horn and directional controls will make putting anything down into the fuel tank a problem; there does not appear to be any screws holding a wieght into it. I'll check it out again. Thanks for all the advice. BTW, the deal was on Ebay, the seller had everything started at 9.99 and told me it was to settle an estate. From the way it happened, there was no reason not to believe her. Box, linen, warranty card, instructions - everything was there. The thing is in sweet condition, even if it doesn't pull worth a $#@%!.

[sulafool]

I had the same problem with my two Christmas RS3s. They did have some factory weight in the fuel tank, but not enough. I fixed them by adding 5.5 ounces of stick on weights (from the hobby store) to each. That was all I could fit under the board, centered more or less in the frame.
Big difference! My litmus test is climbing a standard Lionel trestle grade, and with the weight my RS3s now perform as well as a pullmor Geep. Some may say that isn't much, but it's better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick. After all, we are only talking about 2 puny little can motors and not a Trainmaster...

[ChiefEagles]

I use the black sticky stuff used to seal W/S in vehicles. The rope type. Will hold weights anywhere [even to tops fo shells]. I place weights where I can on the inside of the shell on the frame. I carefully remove the fuel tranks to be sure the plastic pins are stil there. Put weights in the fuel tank and use soldering iron tip to melt the plastic pins to hold tank to frame.

[brianel027]

I don't understand the RS3 as is not pulling much. I at one time had one of those near identical year RS3's and it pulled just fine, no weights added. Though it did have the factory installed weight in the plastic fuel tank.

Those RS3's do ride high off the trucks. There's no easy fix on that one because of the way the sheet metal frame is made: there is a downward dimple/depression where the truck mounts to the frame. I don't know if the newer ones with the plastic frame are the same way.

I've used the self-sticking lead automotive weights as Lionelsoni has, and they work just fine. I have found though in my experiementing that with a single can motored unit it works better to have the extra weight not directly over the motored truck, but just slightly in front of it. I have not been a big fan of single DC can motor truck mounted locos, but have made a few and found to my surprise the weights work better just a little in front of the motored truck. Again, consider the typical 4-4-2 Columbia type starter steamer that comes with many Lionel starter sets: it has a die-cast shell and pulls just fine, but the weight of the shell is balanced front and back of the motor.

It would also be a good idea to see if the traction tires are slipping. I use 3M carpet tape to adhere mine, but others have used glue. Also you might consider inserting a small spring over the guide pin off the truck that slips though the cut slit in the frame. This is an essential fix with the K-Line MP-15's, Alco FA's and S-2's to help keep the front truck from derailing on curves when pulling a train. BUT it also helps put some pressure on the truck itself. And those RS3's have light plastic truck frames.

As a final note, I've long since scrapped my Lionel RS3, using the motored trucks to build other locos, and chopping the shell down (length and height) substantially to fit on a K-Line MP-15 chassis which I think looks great on my small layout.... I like having engines that don't tower above the cars I run.

Of course one small advantage I have of running straight DC current is that I remove all of the electronics out of my locos, giving me more room to add weights should I need to. Which is especially useful for the Lionel Industrial Switcher: mine now could pull 12-15 cars if I wanted them to, but typically a 9-10 car train is no trouble for them (which isn't the case with them straight out of the box).

[Anonymous]

This really surprises me. I have a two-motor Lionel RS-3 and I have pulled more than 20 cars with it on level track. It SEEMS very light but the traction tires grip well. The one-motor RS 3s do not perform well. If I were you I would check that the traction tires are not slipping and also that both motors are turning. Also, look at the direction-control board for signs of loose wires or blow-out on the big transistors. I had a Weaver engine that had only one pair of transistors working, essentially reducing the engine to half-power. Don't forget the possibility of oily track.

I would try to get weight into the fuel tank, but other than that, you should be able to pull a lot with your engine, if it is operating right, without adding weight. There is not much extra room in there, but I was able to add an Ott sound system. My only problem with the engine is that it does not activate the anti-derailing on O-27 switches due to the traction tires.

My Lionel RS 3 has been a favorite for quite some time. It is very reliable, pulls great, and the Ott sound is a nice addition (except you can't do short horns).

Good luck with this.

BRUCE CLOUETTE

[Anonymous]

OK, guys, then here a stupid question. The traction tires do look a little worn; is there any trick to replacing them? My local train shop has just gone out of business due to a retirement, so I will need to source a set of four someplace. Bruce, when you talk about blowout around the transistors, what would that look like. Thanks again.

[Anonymous]

Most reversing units have two pairs of power transistors, which have a square ceramic body, three "legs", and on the back, metal; they usually have a hole through the body so that they can have a heat disipator attached, but most do not have any heat sinking other than the tab on the transistor. Everything else on the board is low-current, but these transistors are what actually control the speed of the motor. So, if you have a long short-circuit on the track, and your transformer does not overload, you can generate so much heat in these that they will melt or crack. If only one pair of two melt down, then the engine will run, but on half power. Same thing if one transistor comes loose or there are loose wires.

You can try replacing transistors, but replacing the board is probably called for.

Our club shorted out a Williams New Haven Alco engine this way. The board made so much heat part of the body melted. Ironically, one of the New Haven's real engines had a fire in almost exactly the same place, so the charring (but not the melting) could actually be considered prototypical..

I have found that old traction tires do slip, but usually they are OK when first running the enigne, then get progressively worse as things warm up..

I hope you keep this engine for a repaint. I repainted a Lehigh Valley Lionel RS-3 into New Haven colors and get a lot of compliments on it. When you put it next to a Weaver you can see the difference in the height of the engine and the stamped handrails. On the other hand, nothing has ever fallen off or broken, so that's the trade-off.

A friend of mine liked this engine so much that he went and bought one - unfortunately, his was a one-engine RS3 that was really anemic.

Good luck

Bruce Clouette