American Flyer 716 dump car

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American Flyer 716 dump car
Posted by Dadscars on Thursday, March 14, 2019 7:56 AM

I am new to this site, however I have been collecting mainly post war to 1956 American Flyer for about 10 years. 

I am looking for information on the 1946 through 1947 car number 716 side dump car, specifically where the powerpick up shoes are located.  I have three of these cars two of which have the pick up shoes in the left truck as you are looking at the opening side and the other has the pick up shoes in the right truck.

Look at the construnction of the car frame they are not reversible.

Can anyone explain way the different configuration. 

Thanks

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Posted by Sturgeon-Phish on Thursday, March 14, 2019 9:55 AM

Some of the early 716s used a center pickup mounted under the truck and the activation was by a special section of track (710?) with a metal contact strip inbetween the AF rails.

When I can I'll look to see about what you are talking about.  Off the top of my head the contact tab was on the oppisit side the car dumped.

Jim

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Posted by Dadscars on Thursday, March 14, 2019 2:19 PM

Sturgeon-Phish

Some of the early 716s used a center pickup mounted under the truck and the activation was by a special section of track (710?) with a metal contact strip inbetween the AF rails.

When I can I'll look to see about what you are talking about.  Off the top of my head the contact tab was on the oppisit side the car dumped.

Jim

 

Jim thanks for your response. I am using a 710 track with the contacts between the rails as the pick ups are underneath the truck between the axles and wheels.

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Posted by Sturgeon-Phish on Friday, March 15, 2019 2:20 PM

Now I understand, yes I've seen the contact on either end.  I thought you were referring to the cars where the contact goes off to one side.

Jim

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Posted by Dadscars on Friday, March 15, 2019 2:34 PM

Hi Jim

I was just wander way they would make two different styles with in a two year period.

Phil

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Posted by Sturgeon-Phish on Friday, March 15, 2019 8:35 PM

My guess is cost.  In one of my reference books it says 46 & 47 used the inside the rail 710.  47 through 51 used the outside third rail contact.  The side contact is less complex.

Jim

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Posted by Dadscars on Tuesday, March 19, 2019 2:17 PM

Hi Jim

I was just wander way they would make two different styles with in a two year period.

Phil

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Posted by Sturgeon-Phish on Tuesday, March 19, 2019 4:40 PM

There are several items that had changes around this time period, many in response to the fairly new two rail configuration.  For instance right now I'm working on some manual switches.  The early versions have less "material" in the base than those just a year or so later.  The actuator lever is different, the flag attachment is different and the rails are more like the  regular track rail than a folded sheetmetal rail.  Early engines had a carry over brass button in the center that if I am correct is a carry over in the frames from the three rail versions, using up the existing frames.  The early link coupler was not weighted, later versions had a black colored weight and others a brass weight. 

It seems that Gilbert was responsive to the market feedback and research in house to make a more reliable cost effficient toy.  I think of it as make it better not just good enough.  The competation between Lionel American Flyer and Marx was pretty stiff.  There were some court battles over innovative products that were very similar.

Jim

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Posted by Dadscars on Wednesday, March 20, 2019 7:56 AM

I can see your point and it makes perfect sense to change from the 710 actuator track to the 712, system. My original question was why would they did they make two different dumper cars in 1946 and 1947. I have three early 716 cars with the pick ups under the trucks. One has the pick up at one end and the other two are at the opposite end. It is not possible to just move the truck to the opposite end.  They actually stamped two different frames as there are extra holes for the wiring.

 

Phil

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Posted by Sturgeon-Phish on Wednesday, March 20, 2019 10:04 AM

I went on Ebay and looked at several 716s specifically the ones with the center pickup.  It is about a 50/50 mix of the end the pick up is on and the direction of the coil/cutout in frame for the coil rod (dump side).  There were holes in the frame at the trucks on either end to allow access for wiring and it was also a mix of exposed wires and wire hidden between the lower frame and the hopper.  All of these observations were made assuming original configurations.

The determining factor of the dump side would be the cutout in the frame for the coil rod clearance, not the end the center pickup was mounted on.

I'd say that as the center pickup frame came down the assembly line or pulled out of a parts bin the coil was mounted to fit in the center coil hole with no concern with the pickup location

Jim

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