497 coaling station, auxillary power and simple uncoupler track

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497 coaling station, auxillary power and simple uncoupler track
Posted by richardm47 on Wednesday, February 20, 2019 11:42 PM

I purchased a 497 Lionel coaling station  (ebay) and it workwed.  ( It is also listed as 2315)  The wire coating was fragile, but I was able to spread cracked insulation out enough to avoid grounds.  The controls work as indicated on the controller.  I've cleaned and steel-wooled surfaces, so it moves freely.   It had the  track clips so I could have used regular track and the older type dump car, which I do not have.  I removed the clips and set it to use a single magnet remote track for the newer dump cars, and that worked  fine.  I noticed that the wires near the motor connected reverse order to the controller.(1,2,3,4 to 4,3,2,1).  I have since taken off the fragile wires and replaced with good 4-wire harness.  Now it does not work.  I lost the paper with my wire drawing.  I dont' have the UCS track, only simple 2 wire uncoupler.  My dump cars are the modern with the center pull and spring.  I want to use the small transformer that powers my other accessories.  I have read several posts, but all use either track power or the UCS track.  

Am I trying the impossible, or should I just locate a UCS track..?   Thanks for the excellent information, especially  for us old 027 guys.

Always in training.  Richard M.

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Posted by Roger Carp on Thursday, February 21, 2019 9:29 AM

Hi Richard,

 

Please contact me at Classic Toy Trains for help with your problem.

 

Sincerely,

 

Roger Carp

Senior editor

262-796-8776 ext. 253

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Posted by richardm47 on Thursday, February 21, 2019 10:15 AM

Thanks for that.  I thought this was CTT.  I'll make sure I'm on the correct forum, when I repost.

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Posted by Roger Carp on Thursday, February 21, 2019 10:51 AM

Hi Richard,

 

You are on Classic Toy Trains. The members of our forum and our editoria staff can help you find answers to your dilemma with the Lionel coaling station.

 

Roger Carp

Senior editor

KRM
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  • From: North Bluff above Marseilles IL
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Posted by KRM on Thursday, February 21, 2019 5:30 PM

Roger Carp

Hi Richard,

 

You are on Classic Toy Trains. The members of our forum and our editoria staff can help you find answers to your dilemma with the Lionel coaling station.

 

Roger Carp

Senior editor

 

Yes Thanks Roger! Sure someone will chime in.

Joined 1-21-2011    TCA 13-68614

Kev, From The North Bluff Above Marseilles IL. Whistling

 

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Posted by NVSRR on Thursday, February 21, 2019 8:46 PM

I did exactly what you are tryingvto do.  There is one wire that ground to the outside rail.  That wire, i rerouted to the ground of the auxiliary power source.  Along with the power wire.   This required a 5 conductor ribbon wire.    Then wire the uncoupler track as you normally would.   

Search  "wire diagram for lionel postwar 497 coaling station".   Go under images and it should be right there.    I ended up buying greenburgs lionel guide.  Has all the diagrams in it.  Really fat book.   

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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Posted by richardm47 on Thursday, February 21, 2019 11:18 PM

I guess I'm a little dense at this time at night.  I did some checking and found continuity from station  "poles" ,2,3,,4 to the station base.  I would think there would be only one??    Or is finding continuity not appropriate in this case.  If that's the case, which wire is grounded to the outside rail.  Reading some of the literature, it seems the station is made to sit on sections of insulated track. Most diagrams use the UCS track, not the simple one buton uncouple track.  There are two loose wires in the setup.. one from the controller adn the other from near the motor.       If we didn't have problems to solve, what fun would this hoby be?     Always in training.  thanks. Richard M.

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Posted by richardm47 on Friday, February 22, 2019 11:52 AM

Here's my dilema.  Originally the unit worked using track power... loose wire from unit to ground clip on track and loose wire on controller to hot on small transformer.  (I don't recall how I hooked up the unloader track, but it dupped the car.  Then I replaced the 4 wire harness with good wire.  Now the 4 wires on the unit connnected to controller.  That leaves the wire from the unit, and the wire from the controller.  Then also the two from the unloader track, and power from the smalll transformer.  I've tried different configuratioins.. Sometimes the unload & load switch just dumps the car.  Sometimes only the motor works -- both directions, but not all 4 at the same time.  Thank you again for all the brain-train power of your group's informaiton

Always in training.   Richard m

KRM
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  • From: North Bluff above Marseilles IL
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Posted by KRM on Friday, February 22, 2019 1:10 PM

 I sent you a PM if you give me a e-mail address I will try to send you a copy of the diagram. I am  having a real problem trying to post it here?

Joined 1-21-2011    TCA 13-68614

Kev, From The North Bluff Above Marseilles IL. Whistling

 

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Posted by NVSRR on Saturday, February 23, 2019 11:45 AM

I am going to look at how I have mine hooked up.   

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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Posted by NVSRR on Sunday, February 24, 2019 10:12 AM

Ok. Sounds like a wire got crossed in there some where.    Hopefully you have found a good wire scheme matic.    Now to isolate it fromthe track for seperate power.  I looked at mine.    You have a four conductor ribbon from the controller to the 497.   You need a fifth wire.   

In the unit you will see where a connection comes from the motor and from the selonoid for the dumb.   That point also connects to the metal frame of the 497.   That is your ground point to the track.  Disconnect that point and isolate it.  The fifth wire is connected to the wire from the selonoid and motor. That fifth wire goes back to the ground for the new power source.  The other wires remain untouched.  The wire from your controler also goes to the other terminal of the separate power Source.

the 497 is now isolated on a seprarate power souce. And will operate as designed.   Once you get the wire schemematic. You will see the connection location to be isolated

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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Posted by richardm47 on Sunday, February 24, 2019 2:07 PM

Thanks for that.  Kind of rainy in Oregon today, so may have some time, after the "inside" jobs get done, and before "Sweetie time"

Thanks.  Richard is always in training.....

Youd' thin somewon wouild provid Spellchick on the forum.... :)  Probably too busy answering train questions or playing with trains....

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Posted by richardm47 on Sunday, February 24, 2019 5:08 PM

I see the wire from the solinoid that is grounded to the motor.  A wire from one of the brushes is also at the same junction.  If I understand what you are saying, I need to remove both the solinoid wire and the brush wire and connect them to my power source ground.  And the 5th wire from the controller goes to the power source.?  What happens to the two wires from my "simple" uncoupling track.?

Still need lots of training..... Richard. 

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Posted by NVSRR on Thursday, February 28, 2019 8:56 AM

If i read right. The uncoupler track is a two wire.   One wire can be wired to the ground.  The same ground from the 497 can be used as long as you use the same power source.  The other wire goes to the button controller.  from there to the power source.  Should work

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

  • Member since
    July, 2013
  • 93 posts
Posted by richardm47 on Thursday, February 28, 2019 10:48 PM

 

That's what I thought.  In fact, my current  layout uncoupler track, that dumps the car, is already wired that way.  But the Coaling station controller has a connection to dump the car too.  I was hoping to use it, but I guess I'll just leave everything connected and not worry about that portion of the controller.

 

Thanks for your help... I'll have to wait a little to put it in place, as several items have come up on my 'honey-do" list.   

As usual, I'm still in training.... Richard.

 

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