Williams Pennsy Madison obs

[Leverettrailfan]

I bought some cars off of eBay, I needed an observation end, so even though it wasn’t a match for my Luxury Lines Baggage (REA) and Pullman (Manhattan). These, I bought, because the price was right. I’d much prefer some postwar cars, but these were what I could afford. They were in line new condition, excellent quality. So, I found another Williams car. It was listed as a 2625 “Madison”. The car’s markings match this. It is prior to the brand being absorbed into Bachman, and to be honest, I was kind of disappointed with the quality. It had a wonderful shell, and the metal frame was nice and sturdy. My satisfaction ends right about here. Firstly, the little air compressor or whatever it is, has not had the flash cleaned up. And, it was not rivitted securely, so you can swivel it. Not the case on the Williams by Bachman Cars. And then- then, there’s the trucks. The trucks are sheet metal, with cheap plastic side frames, that are rather faint/crude recreations of what the classic Madison car side frames looked like. The wheels are fairly accurate reproductions of classic postwar wheels, except they have sharp edges. The castings were not smoothed out at all. This is a little irritating when you’re trying to clean and lube the trucks. A plastic part holds the contact rollers to the trucks. The solder points on the rollers, will short out on the frame when you run the car, so you have to bend them down before you can even use the car. The last thing, is, well, the couplings. They are solid plastic, and molded in such a way, that they will barely cooperate on O-31 track. They have no spring to center the coupling. The other cars, which are Williams by Bachman, could hypothetically be used on O27 (I tested them out on a circle of O27 curves, they could negotiate them and remain coupled). 

 

On the whole, this is rather unfortunate. If only they hadn’t done such a terrible job on the trucks, this would be a really nice car to have. 

 

So, there’s my review. Now, here’s the other thing. I can’t find any reference to a Pennsylvania 2625 Observation End. I have seen similar cars online, but the 2625 was not ever an observation end. The box it was in, says it is a 2623 add on passenger car. Also, the car has a coupling at both ends, despite being an observation end car. So, I’m wondering if the car might have been tampered with. 

 

What are people’s thoughts on this car, both the review aspect of things, and the questions I had. Also, anyone with similar cars, what are your opinions on the quality? I’m curious.

[rtraincollector]

I have had many cars by williams before Bachman entered the picture. Have not had a problem with any except one set I got the observation part of the car was broke off. ( I believe it was before the seller sold to me as it was that way when pulled out of the box ) this was before Ebay backed it buyers. Other wise they seemed to me as they are today. I did glue it back in place and it was fine. Williams 14" cars can handle the O27 track. Williams did O31 statemen for two folds, to make it simple as he had some that took O31 and two a safty margin for him. When you get to the bigger passenger cars they will not handle the O27 track. 

Also back when Williams had it you could pick up the four 14" passenger cars less than $100 today you can't buy that set for less than $200 almost doubled. ( actually Charles Ro has them for $199.95) And the quality for most part isn't much difference in my view. I seem to remember them being advertised for like $88 ( trainworld/charles ro type companies ) 

[Leverettrailfan]

Interesting. I definitely wouldn’t consider these cars to be worth more than their original pricing, if it is as you say,and the quality and construction for these cars are consistent with my findings. 

I’m still confused about the markings on my car. Does anyone have any kind of reference to a Willians 2625 Madison observation end?

[rtraincollector]

I was quoting new then and new now. Niether5 will bring much on a site like Ebay thou.

[Firelock76]

The only reference I have for Williams Madison cars is a "Williams by Bachmann" catalog from 2012.  The 60' Semi-Scale Madison cars came in a four car set, suggested retail (for what it's worth) $299.95.  I have the Erie set, didn't pay anyway near THAT much for it, and the obs car does have a coupler on the obs end.  My catalog doesn't picture a 2625 obs car but there's a PRR coach car pictured with a 2600 number on it I can barely make out.  Quality is first-rate on my Erie cars.

What are Williams cars worth?  That's really up to the purchaser.  Last train show I went to I bought a Williams four car 027 green streamliner "Luxury Lines" set for $125, new in the boxes.  I looked at it this way, those cars are a pretty close match for the Lionel post-war originals, they'll look good behind any of my Lionel post-wars, and since Bachmann gutted the Williams line they're just not made anymore, so I grabbed them.   Nice cars too, so I'm not sorry I made the purchase.

[Leverettrailfan]

I have a set of two “Luxury Lines” cars- but, mine at least, are AFTER the line was bought out by Bachman- they have excellent quality. The 2625 is pre-Bachman, and the quality is good, except for the trucks. They did one better on the 2625, as it has a very thick, black plastic shell, so, although it’s definitely not Bakelite like the classic Lionel postwar cars, it has the thickness, and maybe even the weight of a vintage shell. The Williams by Bachman ”Luxury Lines” REA baggage and Manhattan cars do not have thick shells, but, they DO have proper diecast trucks, and operating couplers. So, they do win my favorite vote. But the 2625 does have pretty darn accurate postwar wheels and axles, so if only the trucks were diecast, with operating couplers, well, I’d be blown away. But hey, we can’t have everything. If it really bothers me enough, I can always shell out the bucks for some new trucks, but I don’t think that will be necessary.