Casey Jones American Flyer 21165 Problem with wheels

[Eric and Sailor]

First post! Hi everyone! Today I purchased what I think is a Gilbert manufactured American Flyer 21165 4-4-0 (my first!) from a very nice gentleman at a train show. He assured me it ran fine. Stupidly, I did not have him test it out, as I'd heard these engines rarely have problems. (Perhaps I heard wrong?) The engine looked fine. When I got home I noticed the wheels move in reverse but not forward. I don't have tracks for this train so am unable to run it myself and - this being Sunday - the local hobby shop is closed. My question: Does this train need to be on the tracks to move forward? In other words, does it require electricity to move forward? Or is it possible I was sold a lemon? Please excuse my novice question!

[zstripe]

Eric and Sailer,

It needs power (electricity) to move forward or backward....It has a motor connected to gear's and it should not move in either direction at all, without power, unless something is disconnected inside. Also is this a S-scale locomotive? This is mainly a N-scale, HO-scale site. The Classic Toy Trains site has S and O-scaler's that will be able to help You more, when You figure out what You have and how to power it.

Not much help......could use more info from You, in order for any one to help You.

To The Forums.

Take Care! 

Frank

[stebbycentral]

Flyer locomotives are "worm drive".  The wheels will lock up if you attempt to turn them manually.  You have to apply power to the motor to get the wheels to turn.  AS you describe yourself as a novice, you may not be aware that these trains have AC motors, (like Lionel), not DC motors like HO.

[Eric and Sailor]

Thanks for your reply! This is an S-Gauge locomotive. I thought I was on the classic toy trains site, whoops! You say: "it should not move in either direction at all, without power, unless something is disconnected inside" ... the wheels definitely move backward, no problem (I can see a mechanism that looks like a bundle of red wires rotating inside), but do not move forward at all. Does it appear I was sold a lemon? Should this train still run?

[cacole]

American Flyer did make some HO scale products, but your locomotive may be S-scale, which runs on AC power.  The American Flyer S-scale trains I grew up with had a power reversing relay that required you to turn the power on-off-on-off two times to reverse direction.

If it is S-scale it will NOT run on a DC power pack.

 

[zstripe]

Eric and Sailer,

Did a little searching and the engine You describe..most definitely should be an S-scale loco, made 1961. I found a video about American Flyer repair clinic should You like to review it and there are many others for You to choose from to watch. I say again You might ask on the CTT (Classic Toy Trains) for help....someone may be able to tell where You can still get Transformers/Track should You want to get going. Just click on link to watch video and other's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaT4osktxOg

Good Luck! 

Frank

BTW: A fast way to get to the CTT site.....scroll down to bottom of this page were the black bars are. The Kalmbach publishing black bar, look for Classic Toy Trains, click on that and it will take You to the site.

[Steven Otte]

Eric and Sailor

Thanks for your reply! This is an S-Gauge locomotive. I thought I was on the classic toy trains site, whoops!

You are now.

[lionelsoni]

A particular worm drive may or may not allow the motor armature to rotate by turning the wheels with enough torque.  It is not surprising that you can do it in one direction and not the other.

American Flyer made both DC motors and universal motors.  The universal motors will run on either AC or DC.  However a DC power supply meant for HO trains may not be able to deliver enough current for a larger S-scale locomotive.

[TrainLarry]

What you see rotating inside ("...bundle of red wires...") is the motor armature. As long as you see this rotating, the motor and drivetrain are free, and should work. You need 'S' gauge track and an AC transformer to check the locomotive out any farther.

Here is the parts view of the locomotive to give you an idea of what is inside.

Larry

[N2Trains]

This might be an easy fix. On the Casey Jones engines, there is a reverse unit located on the back of the motor.  This reverse unit has a metal lever that you can move upand down.  If it is up, it will go in the directi9on it was last running (either forward or reverse).  Lower the metal piece and see if it will then go forward.