basic diesel

[Anonymous]

I am interested in obtaining an inexpensive diesel locomotive for my small O-31 layout. I am running a table-top layout of approximately 96" x 40". Nothing larger than O-31 curves. Does anyone have any recommendations about inexpensive diesels that I can purchase. I tend toward the smaller Lionel "traditional" size rolling stock, such as that which comes with the starter sets. I am open to any manufacturer, not just Lionel. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

K-Line's Alco FA or SW1500 Lionel's RS-3 (find a nice 2-motored one) or a Williams Geep or NW2 (EMD Switcher)

[Anonymous]

Try a Beep from Ready Made Toys. I don't own one yet but from what everyoen else on this board is saying they are the greatest thing next to sliced bread.

[3railguy]

A Williams GP-9 is a good choice. It has vertical can motors with flywheels.

[Anonymous]

A Kline Geep, mp-15, and 1998 ar good choces too.

[brianel027]

Okay, this is my area of expertise. I take it Teamlo that you are looking for something that not only negotiates the tight curves, but "looks" right with the smaller less than scale "traditional" sized rolling stock. This is exactly where I am at, and it has been the first consideration when I have bought engines.

The Lionel or K-Line Alco FA diesels are practically the same height as the 6464-type box cars and look very much at home with them. If you dislike DC can motors, there were a number made by Lionel MPC with the open frame Pulmor motor. I personally prefer the K-Line Alco FA (dual DC can motors instead of the typical single can motor with Lionel) as it is a little more detailed. But I have often repainted them to Norfolk Southern, CSX and Conrail - and in that case prefer the earlier versions.

The K-Line S-2 hasn't been made in a while. K-Line has said they'll never make it again. But it is a short sparce detailed loco (a great candidate for a fix up project as far as adding some details) with dual can motors. The cab height is almost 1/2 inch higher than the 6464 box cars, but the short length and overall loco appearance makes it look right at home with the smaller cars.

The K-Line MP-15 and Lionel (and the new Williams) NW-2 are near-scale proportioned diesels. Both again have cab heights towering over the 6464 box cars, but with the long engine hoods, the appearance isn't as out of place. I have shortened the height of shells on both models and find they look even better on a smaller layout. The MP-15 diesel model is a more recent style of diesel switcher built by GM. The Williams engine is a darn fine runner for the money today and available in nearly road name you might want without having to repaint.

Williams also makes a Centercab Switcher based on the Lionel version. These both are out of scale versions of an actual prototype that is much much smaller. But I have seen other real models of centercab switchers that were bigger and longer, so just think of the Williams centercab as one of those bigger prototypes. The Williams version is decent with a single motor (but a larger motor than with Lionel and also with a flywheel) and has diecast trucks. The Williams Centercab and NW-2 are also among the very very few engines made today that actually come in some modern roadnames and run on tight curves.

The following will all make 027 curves: Williams GP-9, Lionel GP-9 (or 7, 20, and 38... the ones with the apprx. 14 inch length), the Lionel U-36B (14 inch version), and also some of the shorter (and earlier) Railking diesels like the apprx. 14-15 inch length Dash 9, SD-45, FP59 etc. All these locos will tower more than 1/2 inch above your 6464 box cars. If you don't mind that look, fine. I've also shortened the height on the Lionel GP and U-36B shells to make them look more at home on my layout. Also shortening the shells makes the engines appear to be longer than they really are since you are taking away some of the "shoebox" proportions by shortening the shell height.

The Railking locos are nearly impossible to shorten the shell height since the walkway is a part of the shell casting. All the new Railking diesels have gone to scale dimensions, so you would want to look for an older Railking loco. Even these though, still tower above the 6464 box cars. The very best proportioned Railking loco for the smaller cars is the SD90 Mac made in 2001 in Norf. Southern, CP, UP and Caterpillar.... Railking did a very good job on that one with the "compression" of the scale dimensions. I think it is unquestionably the best proportioned and best looking Railking diesel for small layouts.

Money-wise, the Williams locos (if you run without command control) are the best bargain with the best selection of road names. Also, some of the Lionel locos out of their train sets are good deals like the Southern GP38. For whatever reason, many of the separate sale Lionel diesels come with a single motor, but the Southern and Chessie GP38's from the recent sets both have dual can motors. The K-Line diesels I mentioned all come with dual can motors too, though the K-Line locos are the loudest running (gear growl on tight curves) of the group, probably due to gearing. Removing one traction tire from each motorized truck can help with this. But I have some early K-Line locos that do run smooth and quiet.

The new RMT Beep seems to be a very decent loco for the price too, and in an ever increasing number of roadnames. For their low price, you could buy a pair and run them together.

The Lionel Industrial Switchers from the mid-1990's are also a very small sized switching diesel. But these Lionel locos are very cheap (all plastic and unpainted) and very light in weight. They do make excellent kitbashing projects for the money though. With a new paint job, added details, lights and some much needed added weight, they can be made to be excellent runners.

Other than the Williams Centercab and most diecast steam engines, I would avoid any loco that only comes with a single DC can motor, especially the new Lionel ones with plastic truck sides and worse yet, plastic frames. They don't have much pulling power as is.... actually very poor. This can be improved, but you will need to add quite a bit of weight to the loco frame over the motor housing to do this. For a short 4-5 car train on flat non-grade track, I guess they are okay, but you can do better money-wise with a Williams GP-9, NW-2 or K-Line Alco FA or MP-15.

[Anonymous]

If you run conventional I would look on Ebay and purchase MTH proto 1 stuff. Most run on O31 curves,and they are better detailed than Williams engines. Just make sure you replace the battery and keep it charged.They normally sell for around half original MSRP. Also Justrains of Delaware has closeouts on K-Line and Williams engines. Just go to their websight and click on the clearance section.

Dale Hz

[Anonymous]

I'd like to thank everyone who responded to my posting. I think I am going to try a RMT Beep and see how that works out. If only it had a diesel horn. That's all I can see (from postings and web pages) that it lacks for my purposes. Thanks again.

[Anonymous]

My recommendations (diesel only, since that's what you specified): Williams GEEP or NW2; MTH EMD switcher; Lionel EMD or Baldwin switcher; Atlas EMD switcher; K-Line Plymouth; RMT BEEP.

Of these, I must admit that I like the K-Line Plymouth and those homely little BEEPs best--great values for the dollar, and great runners.