"IT's GOOD TO BE THE KING",by Mel Brooks
Charter Member- Tardis Train Crew (TTC) - Detroit3railers- Detroit Historical society Glancy Modular trains- Charter member BTTS
One of the great characteristics of most Marx engines is the simple yet almost bullet-proof motors that power them. Just a bit of lubrication can keep them going for years and years. Even one kept in long term storage can usually be made to run in short order.
The 333 is a fine engine, the top-of-the line steamer for Marx. For sheer fun and smoke output, I'd recommend a 666. Some of these came with steam chest smoke.
The other thing about Marx that is often overlooked is the fact that the cars behind the engine look great and roll well. On more than one occasion I've brought Marx to a tinplate get together and it always draws a lot of favorable comments. Often people are surprised at how good the trains look. I've found this last reaction to be somewhat puzzling but it does occur to me that a lot of people's perceptions of Marx are drawn from the well-played-with offerings found at every train meet and not from seeing Marx in the before-played-with state or in the well-taken-care-of state.
Marx is a lot of fun, no doubt about it. Although prices are definitely higher than they were four years ago when I started paying attention, common Marx stuff is still inexpensive. So you can buy it, run it, and if something bad happens, it's not a really big deal. There are always several gray Marx PRR plastic O27 gondolas on eBay with asking prices of $10 or less and no takers.
As far as the economies of converting vintage Marx to Lionel couplers, I don't know that it really increases the demand. There are still some who turn up their noses every time the word "Marx" comes up (not so much here, but I see it in other venues pretty frequently) so those guys won't buy it regardless of whose coupler is on it. And Marx has a pretty good following of its own, although it's largely underground (the 9-year-old Marxtrain group on Yahoo has almost 1,200 registered members). Some of those guys buy converted Marx pieces and then change them back. People have been replacing Marx trucks and/or couplers to run them with AF and Lionel since the 1950s. I have a Louis H. Hertz book from the mid 1950s where he recommends it as a way to save money.
I constantly hear people harp on Marx's quality, but I really wonder if any of those naysayers ever actually owned and ran a Marx piece or worked on one. The motor is very simple, which means fewer parts to break, and if something does go wrong, it makes it easy to fix. Of all the Marx locomotives I ever encountered, 75% of them ran with me doing nothing more than putting on some fresh grease and oil and cleaning the crud off the driver wheels. The rest needed more thorough cleaning, but still nothing terribly major. I only ever found one I couldn't get running, and there's so much rust and corrosion in it, it's no wonder. I still hold out hope that I'll get it going someday too.
Some years ago I was having a conversation with Maury Klein, original founder of K-Line Trains. The conversation came around to the topic of "toy" trains and K-Line's newer product offerings. I was told that K-Line wasn't using the "027" phrase in their catalogs as much, as either a product designation or a minimal radius because "027" turns away scale customers, who might not otherwise realize something can sometimes be scale and still negotiate the basic 027 curve. Lionel was doing the same thing for a while: products that absolutely cleared 027 switch boxes, were being listed with 031 minimum curves.
I bring this up because the hobby suffers some because of all the "scale" polarity. I agree with you Dave, that MARX gets a bum rap because most of what MARX made were "027" toy trains. Even with flat tin and lithography, MARX Trains have a surprising level of detail and accuracy - even though that accuracy may not be to scale proportions. There's also a reliabilty and durability factor, regardless of MARX's ingenious cost cutting techniques, that many more modern expensive trains cannot compare with... and in the long run, will more than likely never live up to.
The irony is that so many MARX Trains went to kids who played with the trains the way a kid might be expected to, then got put aside into storage - AND YET with a little maintenance and TLC these same trains still work, or can easily be made to work again.
I've said it many a time, that there is an undeniable charm to the US made MARX Train products. And that is not relegated to just the trains themselves.
While the hobby has advanced technologically and detail-wise, those advancements have sometimes been left behind for debate over every aspect of the hobby, and for on the part of some, a perpetual constant unhappiness with any of the train products currently available. And the minute a new train product comes out, the train importers are expected to drop another $3 million for another totally new model with a small run of 1,500-2,000 locomotives that will also absolutely lose money. I fully expect kids to act like kids... not some adults to do the same.
Yep, we talk about the advancements in the hobby today, but I am beginning to think the best advancements are the ones that were made decades ago.
By the way, it's easy enough to put Lionel trucks on MARX cars and I've done it many a time. Cost effecitve? For me, yes, but it depends what you pay for the cars and then the truck sets.
brianel, Agent 027
"Praise the Lord. I may not have everything I desire, but the Lord has come through for what I need."
Brian: I don't suppose your conversions mean you have loose Marx trucks laying around? That's something I'm always looking for.
2343: Yes you can. And I suspect Marx may have intended it that way. I use Marx locos with Lionel tenders pretty frequently.
baberuth73: $125 might be a little high for a 333, but I don't know that I've ever seen one go for much less than $100. Anything is possible though. It's been a while since I've looked.
Brian brings up a good point as far as financials. The reason Marx trains were so inexpensive was because Marx would make the tooling and use it for decades. Some of the tooling for the 6" tin cars got used for 40 years. The tin litho printing changed, but under the ink, the parts were still the same. The plastic molds had a shorter run, but it was still about 20 years. Then of course K-Line got another 20 years out of some of it.
The reliability was a cost-saving measure too. I don't know when the practice ended, but for a long time, if your motor failed, Marx would fix it for free if you mailed it to them or brought it to the company in person. It was cheaper to build it so that it wasn't likely to break.
That's why Marx was able to sell train sets for $14 even in the early 1970s.
I went to e-bay last night and did a search for 333 under the Marx heading. They are PRICEY!! One was over $200.00! Don't think I will worrying about aquiring one any time soon.
I've been running mine with a Lionel tender at the moment. My 1829 is not a great puller, but will pull the cars I got with it. Two of the Marx cars for the set have broken couplers, so I think I will replace those with K-line trucks I have laying around, giving me two "conversion" cars, and also allowing to still run it as a set.
I startd picking up some Marx tinplate a few years ago. really like the litho work.
last year I bought a Marx 333 to pull them. Now I'm on the hunt for a NYC to go behind it. great runner.
Dave
It's a TOY, A child's PLAYTHING!!! (Woody from Toy Story)
Dave Farquhar wrote:Another option is to clip Lionel's postwar knuckle assembly (the one that clips onto the axles) onto the Marx truck. It fits perfectly.
I use these("conversion coupler") assemblies for Marx tenders, they give variety beyond the standard "Lionel Lines".
Rob
I've noticed the crazy prices for 333 locos on ebay as well. The modern K-line versions are a steal. Some of them have Railsound tenders as well. If you're going to use it as a runner on your layout the K-line is the way to go. Saw this on ebay
http://cgi.ebay.com/K-Line-Locomotive-and-Tender-Pacemaker-0-0-27-Gauge_W0QQitemZ250205379417QQihZ015QQcategoryZ28139QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
I continue to buy my Marx items from http://trainmarket.com - decent prices, large variety.
Doug Murphy 'We few, we happy few, we band of brothers...' Henry V.
I remember in my travels years ago, when I was looking for Lionel postwar, I came across a lot of Marx trains as well. The usual scenario was an O-27 Lionel set of some description with a lot of Marx switches, track and accessories. Here in Canada, back in the fifties, the Lionel premium sets were even more out of financial reach, because of the Customs duties and taxes to import them from the U. S. where they were made. Marx was affectionately known as "poor-man's Lionel". I DID come across a fair bit of what I believe was known as "3/16" Marx. That stuff was really nice-it was highly detailed, looked quite realistic, except for the tilt couplers and was quite reasonably priced (in comparison to Lionel). There were versions of this "3/16" in both metal and plastic, both equally as attractive. I don't see or hear much about this type of Marx anymore. Must be mostly in the hands of collectors now, or else it was discarded by most people over the years.
I have a bit of the Marx 3/16 stuff. I like it. The 6" tin and the larger plastic gets more attention, but there's a fair bit of 3/16 out there. I passed up a bunch of 3/16 at an estate sale about four years ago and I'm kicking myself for it. The price struck me as high, and it might have been, but I should have researched it a little more.
In the years since, I've picked up a few of the 3/16 cars. They generally aren't bright and shiny like other Marx tin (although some of them are) but they certainly grew on me. I like the green GAEX DF boxcar. The color scheme is attractive, but I like that it has my initials on it. I seem to find them on the bigger Lionel-size trucks more often than on the smaller 3/16 scale trucks.
I've also got a lot of Marx deluxe plastic cars, plus some of the K-Line reissues. Interesting thing is that the 21429 and 28236 deluxe hoppers are not in proportion with the other Marx cars - they're too wide. But they go nicely with Lionel cars.
The Lionel 6456 hopper (and other similar small hoppers) are too narrow for Lionel cars but they're in perfect proportion to the Marx deluxe plastic cars. I put Marx trucks on a Lionel hopper to get a nice hopper on my Marx trains.
Marx HO (to change the topic) is better than its reputation. My Marx HO engines run acceptably (they're not Kato's), much better than Lionel HO. Every Lionel diesel that I have needs to be repowered to run acceptably. Also, Marx HO wheelsets are in gauge; Lionel HO wheelsets are 0.015" too narrow.
Lionel is the gold standard, but I marvel at the simplicity and economy of a Marx motor. I just purchased this 1666 from forum member Dr. John.
It's wonderful. It smokes incredibly well and runs so smooth and reliably. My kids set up a figure 8 yesterday and have been running trains on the floor the past 2 nights for a change of pace. That Marx steamer smokes like an MTH, pulling 2400 series cars around that tubular track!
Tip a figure 8 on its side and you have the symbol for infinity. That seems to be how long a Marx train will run.
Jim
Modeling the Baltimore waterfront in HO scale
Jumijo wrote: Tip a figure 8 on its side and you have the symbol for infinity. That seems to be how long a Marx train will run. Jim
"To infinity, and beyond!"
2343 wrote:I found that substantial voltage was required to power the engine as compared to my Lionel 675.
That's unusual. Marxes have a well-deserved reputation for being racers. The 666 less so than some of the others, but mine still run like rabbits. It makes me wonder if yours needs fresh lube, and maybe it needs the driver wheels to be cleaned up. I find most Marxes need both of those things anyway, but that's usually the only thing they need.
5:08 PM the ### still has about 1 1/2 hours to go and still at $453.00.
Bill Cosby was right,,,,,brain damaged.
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