Some Random Classic Pics perhaps worthy of Discussion

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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, February 18, 2020 9:37 AM

Ok I've tracked it down.

Former Virginian Rwy. Yard in Roanoke, Virginia Aug. 1985

' Some units stored but for most time has run out'

Identifiable: 

Southern SD35's 3032 & 3066

Conrail SDP45's 6678 & 6683

N&W GP18 #941; Alco C630 #137

Chesapeake & Western Alco T6 #11 

 

 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, February 18, 2020 10:16 AM

Erik_Mag

When I first heard the name of that railroad, I thought it was in a l-o-n-g tunnel. Wayne probably remembers the Underground Railroad episode of "The Great Adventure" which aired early 1964.

Would have loved to see the street running that took place between my high school and the jr high that I attended 8th and 9th grades. I would also liked to have seen the street running on two streets that I crossed to and from my 7th grade jr high in front of what is now the Nevada Governors Mansion.

 

I sure do!  The episode was called "Go Down Moses," and starred Ruby Dee as Harriet Tubman.  Great performance by Ruby, she showed how tough Harriet really was.  

And here it is...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYdS0Exk7oU  

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:50 AM

Street Running... how about ' Front Yard Running' !!

"Right in her own front yard". Rock Island train bound for Columbus Junction with former CRIP #1247 on the point.

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Posted by GeoffS on Wednesday, February 19, 2020 11:05 AM

Wow! The Rock looks like it's about to roll over!  Are these tracks still there?

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, February 19, 2020 11:47 AM

Don't know. It's in Burlington, Iowa.  Considering Iowa has lost a heck of a lot trackage since and it's the Rock Island I would say the chances are pretty fair that it does not exist today, but that's only a guess. Someone here might know, or a good railroad map of the area. 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, February 19, 2020 12:42 PM

GeoffS

Wow! The Rock looks like it's about to roll over!  Are these tracks still there?

 

I wouldn't think so, in fact from the look of that locomotive the tracks were probably poorly maintained at the time with the idea the line would be abandoned soon and the tracks pulled up, so why spend the money to keep it up?  And wow, look at all the weeds along the right-of-way!  I'd say that line didn't have long to live.  

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Posted by GeoffS on Wednesday, February 19, 2020 1:30 PM

Must be gone.  Mike Walker's atlas shows CRIP tracks abandoned from Burlington north to Columbus Junction and on although tracks still go east west in Columbus Jct.  You can follow tracks north from Burlington for a short distance on Google satellite but they end near a trail (what else?).  Must have been fun living so close to those tracks once!

 

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Posted by M636C on Wednesday, February 19, 2020 7:16 PM

 Don't know if these are ex-EL long-chassis units, one of which certainly wound up in Roanoke for the longest time 

The nearer unit definitely is an SDP45. On a standard SD45, the radiator casing extended right to the end of the hood. A narrower hood extension beyond the radiator is just visible on the nearer Conrail unit.

Peter

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:50 PM

More fascinating items:

1)  New York Central 4-6-0's with assigned commuter trains. Yorktown Heights NY Sept 9, 1951.  Nice to see ten wheelers on the mighty Central this late in the game but I imagine their time will be coming up real soon.

 

2)  Sticking with smaller steam, you just got to love an 0-6-0. Toiling away in obscurity for decades putting it all together. This one is interesting. 

CN Stratford shop engine 7312 (an 0-6-0 built by Baldwin in 1908 for the Grand Trunk Railway) is pictured just removed from service in March 1960. 7312 would soon be sold to the Strasburg Railroad in Pennsylvania for tourist service, where it acquired the number 31. It is still in service today, restored to its previous CN number 7312

 

 

3)  You know for a while The Pennsy actually looked pretty good, even their gons!

 

4)  The seldom talked about Monongahelia. Along with N&W these are small rural town scenes that are now vanished.

 

5)  Here's one for NDG.  Henry Morgans ( not the famous pirate) department store on St. Catherine St. in Montreal 1890. It was Canada's first department store.  Simply called Morgans , Henry eventually opened stores across the country.  They were also kind of higher class, really a cut above. I remember the Morgans in Hamilton and their fabulous windows and at Christmas the decorations were breath taking. By the way the building is still standing. They were eventually purchased by Hudson's Bay.

 

6)  Going to a Cubs game?  Take the streetcar of course.  Don't think you can do this any longer, maybe buses? 

 

7)  Breaking Bad made Albuquerque NM famous again but before that was Bugs Bunny making a wrong turn and before that was the Santa Fe and their sprawling magnificent backshop.

Progress or downhill ? .. the Roundhouse is gone!

 

8)  At one time the New York Central was a household name. It was just a teenager when this pic was taken, it had a glorious future. It is hard to fathom it is no more, and so much of it's infrastructure is gone.

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:07 PM

4-6-0s at Yorktown Heights:   Ten-wheelers handled all Putnam Division trains, the peddler freight as well as passsenger trains.  Most commuter trains ran only between Yorktown Heights and Sedgewick Avenue Terminal's connection to the 9th and 6th Avenue elevated trains, with a stop at High Bridge for transfer to Hudson Division MUs to and from GCT.  Two trains each weekday each way ran to and from Brewster and the wye connection with the Harlem Div. there. 

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Posted by NDG on Thursday, February 20, 2020 12:18 AM

 

 

Morgan's.
 
Thank You for posting the photo of Morgan's.
 
After the War we shopped at Morgan's and Eaton's and Simpson's and Ogilvy's downtown in Montreal, going down and back by streetcar, Route 3A.
 
After c. 1950, Rte 3B was a shorty Yellow Coach, our first introduction to the Autobus.
 
Here is a later view of Morgan's, streetcars removed in 1956.
 
 
The Apostrophe still RULES!!  a Quebec Thing, later.
 
 
On Alymer, the next street East, was Tramways Alymer Terminus which turned back streetcars on Ontario St. and was last route to use Tramways Trains, two cars coupled in MU, one Motorman, two Conductors.
 
Rtes 5 82.
 
 
FWIW.
 
Purchased my first copy of " Trains " @ Morgan's in the Fifties.
 
Wooden escalators in old section thru Sixties.
 
 
Montreal's Eaton's had one of the Eaton's Trains.
 
Eaton's Trains.
 
 
 
More FWIW.
 
 

Thank You.

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Posted by Miningman on Thursday, February 20, 2020 1:32 AM

Wow! Great post NDG. I remember those wooden escalators in Hamilton, they made their own peculiar sound, I can still hear it, but it's difficult to describe. A powerful but rickety sound at odds with each other.  Creaking and groaning but with purpose and calm certainty. They roared, not quiet. Those Eaton's models were superb. Nothing like that today, the care and the expense, man we had it good. It was a celebration not a gimmick.

Luved the article in Canada Rail about the CPR Electric Lines. We spent our summers and other holidays in Simcoe and Port Dover. What a rich environment we had. I just knew as a kid it was all to good, all too perfect, to last.  You just know that somehow. For a short while, for me, we had Pere Marquette steam, Wabash steam, CNR steam, CPR steam, NYCentral steam and the Electric Lines.  You could book a sleeper from the beautiful old Grand Trunk (CNR) station in Simcoe to anywhere in North America, and return, it was simple and normal to do. 

All of that, every single rail, tie and spike is gone. 6 Railroads removed from the face of the earth. 

I think, I know,  they would give their eye teeth to have the Electric Lines back now but it would be impossible. They simply should have recognized with great certainty and clarity what they had and what they would lose. 

So instead Morgan's is gone, Eaton's has vanished, Studebaker is gone, The Lake Erie and Northern is gone, the Grand River Rwy is gone as are all the CPR Electric lines, even the CASO is gone and CN and CP have left the area and now track way way North of it all, those branches hacked off.  None of that makes a stick of sense to me, not at all. Something more to it all than meets the eye. 

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Posted by NDG on Thursday, February 20, 2020 4:30 AM

 

OT.
 
OF COURSE!!!!!
 
Its the 2020s now!!!!
 
When you want to find something you ask Alexa or go to Youtube.
 
HERE are Wooden Escalators!
 
Morgan's Montreal's were single-wides.
 
 

Thank You.

P S.

Not all customers would be going to the top floors, so Escalators would be narrower as you went up, to save cost.

 

Some Escalators had Electric Eye Beams at their bottoms.

 When not in use, the motors would drop down to a low-idle speed, and soon as a patron broke the light beam, they would speed up.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Thursday, February 20, 2020 10:16 AM

As far as getting to Wrigley Field, the #22 Clark line and #152 Addison line (ex-Chicago Motor Coach) will take you there.  However, the L is the best way to get there, with a stop on the Red Line right at Addison, only a block from the main entrance.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by Flintlock76 on Thursday, February 20, 2020 12:16 PM

Some more great photos from Miningman!

Photo one, those 4-6-0's at Yorktown Heights?  I'm glad David beat me to the punch commenting on those, he knows 'em better than I do.  A fine sight.  How long did they have to live?  As far as I know NYC steam was gone in the Greater New York Area by 1954, although it did hang on a bit longer in the Midwest.

Now talk about hanging on!  7312 is definately alive and kickin' at Strasburg!  If I remember correctly Linn Moedinger said 7312 was their "Old Reliable," their go-to engine when everything else was down.  Linn said "It moans, it groans, it makes odd noises, but it never gives up!"

Ah, Photo 7.  "Progress or downhill?"  The missing turntable and roundhouse.  Probably both.  Many railroads found out pretty quickly, in most cases anyway, roundhouses just didn't work for diesels and had to upgrade their maintanance facilities quickly.

Wooden escalators.  Man, it's been decades, but I think I remember wooden escalators at the old Packard's department store in Hackensack NJ.  Emphasis on the "I think,"  Packards is gone now and I believe the last time I was in there I was 10 years old.  I'm 66 now and some things are a bit hazy from when I was 10.

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Posted by Overmod on Thursday, February 20, 2020 12:46 PM

Flintlock76
Now talk about hanging on!  7312 is definitely alive and kickin' at Strasburg!  If I remember correctly Linn Moedinger said 7312 was their "Old Reliable," their go-to engine when everything else was down.  Linn said "It moans, it groans, it makes odd noises, but it never gives up!"

For context on this, see here:

http://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=44138

Wooden escalators.  Man, it's been decades, but I think I remember wooden escalators at the old Packard's department store in Hackensack NJ.  Emphasis on the "I think,"  Packards is gone now and I believe the last time I was in there I was 10 years old.  I'm 66 now and some things are a bit hazy from when I was 10.

There's a memory.  I was good friends with Frank Packard at Knickerbocker, and his wife gave me the definitive shrimp-and-artichoke-heart recipe (don't make 6lb for dinner; you'll try to eat it all...)  Strange that I don't remember escalators in that store ... was too young and not looking around carefully enough.  That was still the era of hand-operated crossing gates staffed from cabins not very far away, and when I was there I'd park in Packard's parking lot but not go in.  Now I wish, again, that I could drive up there and do that.

There were wooden motorstairs (as they were called there) in what remained of Penn Station when I was young -- I think some of them went down to the 7th Avenue subway.  They had the memorable klunk that has been mentioned.  However, they did not hold a candle to the wooden 'escalators' at South Street Station in Boston circa 1974, which as I recall slanted downward like a bunch of pallets, with a well-worn finish to the wood that provided dubious traction: one held on to the rails very carefully, almost for dear life, as you racketed upward, watching the peculiarly stiff perhaps terror-based posture of the people clinging on above you.  I wondered at the time if this was some sort of technical breakage in the escalator mechanism -- it was one of those things like the continuous European elevator systems that couldn't possibly be legal in any sane society, but apparently got built anyway.

Of course, Macy's (in Herald Square) memorably kept their many wooden escalators when they renovated half a decade ago, and you can ride them there... or find them on YouTube.  Here is https://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/26/nyregion/macys-historic-wooden-escalators-survive-renovation.html]the New York Times report on it.  And here is an amusing recent account with Kalmbach-appropriate content reference included.

 Perhaps Peter Clark can tell us about the ones in Sydney.

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Posted by Miningman on Thursday, February 20, 2020 12:48 PM

Thanks for relating the stort on 7312. It's been in service since 1908, imagine that, 112 years. 

I'm sure it worked around the clock during the war years '39-45. The colour picture in March 1960 shows it just hours after being removed from service. Stack not capped, everything intact. Glad it avoided the blast furnaces. 

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Posted by NDG on Thursday, February 20, 2020 1:12 PM

 

FYI.,

CN 7312.
 
 

Thank You.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Thursday, February 20, 2020 3:28 PM

Interesting, that "Rypn" page on 7312.  Looks like it was working in 2007, which is probably when I read that Moedinger quote.  Or earlier.  What can I say, it stuck!

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Posted by NDG on Thursday, February 20, 2020 3:48 PM

 

FYI.
 
At the end, Right Next Door, Numerically, but, Muchly Different.
 
 
 
Note Cast Iron numbers on cab side.
 
Thank You.

 

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Posted by Miningman on Friday, February 21, 2020 11:08 AM

NDG-- That's a remarkable find. How many steam locomotives scrapped California to Newfoundland-- 100,000? In a short time frame too, post war to early 60's.  Along with the scrapping came other scrapping, that of the builders themselves, the knowledge, the skills, the infrastructure, the tools, and most certainly the romance, admiration and wonderment.

When steam was scrapped the public left the railroads too, first in their minds and then with their wallets. That friendly and warm association was scrapped as well.

We hang on to a few threads of it all through preservation but I wonder if following generations will have that kind of commitment as it was not part of their daily lives. 

2) Updated photo of those NYC 4-6-0's with their commuter line ups in 1951.  Broader, wider photo, note old passenger cars in the background probably used for MOW. 

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, February 22, 2020 12:24 PM

NDG.  You remember them as MUs.  I remember the many two-car Montreal trains as motor and trailer, not MU.  Am I wrong?

Before the massive "bustitution." Dorchester Avenue was a transit-free blvd., only private cars.  On St. Catherins Street, one block south, the main commercial street, at each intersection four-to-six streetcars and streetcar trains would be lined up waiting for the green.  At the green, each "Guard de Moteur" (Sp) would wind up his controller, trusting that the one ahead would be doing the same thing without any mechanical and electrical problems, and so every 1-1/2 minute around 1800 people were moved across the intersection, with 76,000 people handled in one lane.  Streetcars doing a subway-line's jpb.  To handle the same number of people with buses, half the routes had to be shifted to Dorchester Blvd.

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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, February 22, 2020 3:54 PM

Montreal had MU cars used in single-ended six motor sets, four on the lead car, two on the MU "trailer".  Westinghouse P-K-35-GG controllers, basically K35 controllers mounted under the car - operated by air pistons controlled by low voltage air valves.  This type of control was briefly used on ex-Connecticut Company open cars at Seashore Trolley museum in the 1960s.  The "trailer" cars had master controls so they could be moved independently.  The MU sets were used on lines with up to 13% grades.

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Posted by NDG on Saturday, February 22, 2020 4:25 PM

Mr. Drye.

Thank You for posting this information!!! 

 

Montreal had VERY STEEP GRADES on some routes.

On Rte 65 Cote de Neiges, often the Circuit Breaker above the Motorman would ' Open ' scaring everyone and causing the car to roll back at stop light at Cedar.

Older cars prohibited that had Trolley Voltage on Controller on Front Platform, and most Work Equipments.

 

Thank You.

 

Regarding Motors and Trailers, Montreal Tramways.
 
I am not an expert in Montreal's streetcars, and much of their history was before my time, as they say.
 
From memory.
 
Montreal went to trailers as mentioned, because motor and trailer sets could pass thru intersections faster than two motor cars with Motormen each.
 
First trailers were just that. pulled by a Motorcar ahead, no trolley pole, and a jumper for electric lights and heating.
 
The next set of trailers had TWO 2 Traction Motors on one truck, a trolley pole, a MU Jumper for traction gear
 
Some of the motorless trucks COULD be MOTORED, but were not, at this time.
 
The last set of Trailers were FULLY MOTORED and had a MOTORMAN'S Position so they could run as ONE MAN Car alone,
as this Motorman had  a Farebox at the front.  When a Trailer, the man in that seat collected fares, provided change and Transfers,
being a Conductor.
 
These cars were operated in MU like locomotives and had switch gear to Trail, or be run as One car alone.
 
I could be wrong, but, when Trailer Operation ceased, the latest Trailers became One Man cars, repainted as such.
 
Not sure, but, then Company may have Four-Motored the Two-Motored Trailers, installed Motorman's Controls and made one-man cars out of them, allowing the Company to retire many of the old heavy Two-man cars as no longer required.
 
This book goes in to great depth re Trailers and much else.
 
 
Lachine 91 ran Two-Man cars right to the end using Lead Motor Cars from MU Trailer set as modern equipments, replacing
the heavy c. 1914 cars, as, with cut backs, it was cheaper to run Two-Man cars than build new track loops in lieu of Wyes in place
for another year of Service.
 
Millen 24 and Montreal Nord 40 ran DOUBLE END Single Man cars right to the end, using a crossover at South end, and a Wye at
East end.. Where the two routes met in the centre there was a turning loop w electric switches at Limites.
 
A Few of One Man cars were equipped to be ' Backed ',  using a special handle so Motorman could back thru a Wye a controller set in rear window sill as he looked out and guided trolley rope.
 
Somerled had Single Man  cars for this at Walkley, and similar cars used at Montreal Nord on Wye.
 
Double end cars w Trolley and controls on both ends did not need to Wye, and just returned the way they had come.
 
 
 
As shown, Rte 40 WAS single track RIGHT TO THE END IN 1959.
 
Double end car @ Gouin. Motorman will change ends and retrace the route not lining switches in Wye.
 
 
 
Thousands more word could be written,  ad nauseam, and one could STILL be wrong and nit-picked to death.
 
We made a point of making ' Last Trips ' when it was announced that Autobusses would be taking over.
 
TTC in Toronto ran PCCs in MU in the Seventies on Queen.
 
Have to go. Starbucks awaits.
 
Kat not happy.
 
The usual.
 

Thank You.

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Posted by NDG on Saturday, February 22, 2020 9:08 PM

 

Montreal Tramways Operation on Dorchester Boulevard.
 
The Tramways operated on a portion of Dorchester South of Ste. Catherine thru 1955, from Cote de Neiges East to University. View 1941 coloured map.
 
 
 
Not marked Dorchester, here.
 
 
There was ONCE an image on Internet showing streetcar stop on Dorchester @ Mansfield where it was possible to board and descend
from streetcars on centre of road islands and descend directly into CNR Central Station thru a corridor at Concourse level.
 
C. 1950 we used to travel Route 65 from Snowdon Jct. to downtown, which was quicker than going along Ste. Catherine on 3 A or kin,
if one was going to connect with Trains at CPR  Windsor Station or CNR Central Station.
 
By streetcar, this water tower was visible to the South/Right and you knew you were almost there.
 
 
Restored, In ENGLISH!!! ( Thank You!! ) Tracks CPR Lucien L'Allier Stn. beyond. Once CPR Windsor Stn. withOUT Train Shed.
 
Green-Roof tower of once CP Windsor Stn. Head Offices to left.
 
Train Shed, Windsor Stn.
 
 
 
Early View Windsor Stn. looking downgrade. Arc Lights.
 
 
 
We were on Ste. Catherine at the End of Streetcars Parade on that Route in 1956.
 
All cars gone in fall 1959. There, also.
 
Seaway opened 1959 replacing Lachine Canal and it's Canallers.
 
Whistles in the night to Bridge Tenders. (  3 Long Blasts on Whistle. )
 
 
If that was not enough, In June 1960 we lost CP STEAM.
 
A Fave with not long to go.
 
 
Long time ago.
 
Thank You.
 
FWIW.
 
On B&W Tramways Track Plan.
 
Note portion of Single Track on Hochelaga top right.
 
This was controlled by Semaphores. 
NDG
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Posted by NDG on Monday, February 24, 2020 6:04 AM
Montreal Tramways Train.
 
Lead Four Motor Two Man Car. Conductor's Position at rear.
 
 
 
 
Second Four-Motor One Man Car. Conductor's position at Front so entry doors on BOTH cars adjacent at car stops
 
 
This car equipped with Route Signs and Numbers to operate as One-Man car in off peak times.
 
Motorman collected fares and operated car.
 
Front of car painted Creme to advise Patrons to board at Front, w Signage
 
 
As Autobusses took over, Modern Two-Man Cars moved on to Lachine 91 route as Wyes both ends.
 
Replaced older Two Man cars.
 
Derailed on diamond Can Car Spur. Interlocked. 1943. Car behind assisting.
 
 
Turcot East. End CNR Catenary to left ex Central Station.
 
 
 
Near the end. Running as single two-man car on Lachine 91, as Wyes at both ends of run. Note Red Marker, Right Rear.
 
 
Tail of Wye, Lachine. Tree growing location of rear truck streetcar.
 
 
 
New Car.
 
 
 
Looking North. Grade up to CPR Windsor Station.
 
 
From this Source.
 
 
 

Thank You. 

 P.S.

 I do NOT know when MOTORLESS Trailers last used?? Sorry.

Depression changed Traffic Flows.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, February 25, 2020 12:24 PM

This is for the Mod-Man and myself, just a little North Jersey "remember when?"

You folks don't have to look if you don't want to, but I bet a lot of you will!

I remembered right about those wooden escalators in Packards!

http://www.hackensacknow.org/index.php?topic=2573.0  

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, March 4, 2020 10:18 PM

NDG-- As a betting man I would have bet large that Montreal would keep its Streetcars (and Interurbans) and Toronto would have ripped up every single streetcar line. I would have lost large, still is a headshaker.

Liked your story about the Buffalo visit and the FM trio H10-44's working away ( over on String Lining). 

So here is its big brother the H20-44. This one is in Avis, Pennsylvania but I think some of these were assigned to the branch that went up to Ottawa, Ontario and likely the last loco assigned to that service. It's a handsome beast, mighty long horn! Looks like a boss! 

 

2)  More NYC .. another view of X5313 that we discussed a while back. It ended up on the TH&B but here it is alongside rows of forlorn equipment. 

 

3)  Now this is a busy busy busy factory! Wonder what it sounded like with all the huffing, chuffing and whistles. Gotta luv it! 

 

4)  Ok, read 'em and weep boys. 5 New York Central complete resplendent train sets all lined up in LaSalle St. Station. How exciting to board and look forward to a great trip, good sleep, fantastic food. The Red Caps, the Porters, the no nonsense Conductor, that railroad scent that is unmistakable, the solid black steel steps and handrails... well you get the idea. All gone. All the trains, even LaSalle, even private enterprise passenger service in competiton. 

Ya, ya, ya,  I read 'Who Shot the Passenger Train', heard all the BS. 

So get out there driving on a jam packed white knuckled highway surrounded with monster rigs galore and idiot drivers in their SUV's. Better still fight you're way to the airport, park and walk forever, pay big bucks, make sure you're 2 hours early, get frisked, poked, humiliated and scanned and sit in the runway for a long time, jammed in with nobody who wants to be friendly to you... oh and don't bring much luggage, and prepare yourself for certain misery... repeat on the other end.  

Oh yeah, it's just brilliant we shunned our trains. 

 

5) More great stations.

Boston North Station

If you don't like that you can always go to Boston South!

Louisvile and Nashville Union Station, Offices and Yards.

At least this is still standing but it's a Hotel.

 

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Posted by Miningman on Saturday, March 7, 2020 1:34 PM

A follow up to this:

4)  Ok, read 'em and weep boys. 5 New York Central complete resplendent train sets all lined up in LaSalle St. Station. How exciting to board and look forward to a great trip, good sleep, fantastic food. The Red Caps, the Porters, the no nonsense Conductor, that railroad scent that is unmistakable, the solid black steel steps and handrails... well you get the idea. All gone. All the trains, even LaSalle, even private enterprise passenger service in competiton. 

Ya, ya, ya,  I read 'Who Shot the Passenger Train', heard all the BS. 

So get out there driving on a jam packed white knuckled highway surrounded with monster rigs galore and idiot drivers in their SUV's. Better still fight you're way to the airport, park and walk forever, pay big bucks, make sure you're 2 hours early, get frisked, poked, humiliated and scanned and sit in the runway for a long time, jammed in with nobody who wants to be friendly to you... oh and don't bring much luggage, and prepare yourself for certain misery... repeat on the other end.  

Oh yeah, it's just brilliant we shunned our trains. 

 Can you do this on a plane or in your car?  Sitting face to face with family or a few buddies, or even interesting strangers and having a great dialogue with all. It's more condusive, more inviting, more behaved, more civilized on a train...it just is due to its very nature, setting and 'atmospheric's'. 

Afterward you can go for a delightful meal all the while enjoying your surroundings and view. Try doing that in a plane!

Then you can walk around and find yourself relaxing here.

I would say this is the hallmark of a civilized society and not a brainwashed bunch of worker bee drones and ridiculous spin of Madison Ave marketing gurus lying for their masters. 

We had it, had it all, wrecked it, wrecked it all. What's left is hanging on but even the railfans on these Forums are against what remains. They say it's 50's thinking, nostalgia, nonsense.

I say it's a mark of civilized society that knows the true value of wellness, calmness, a decent pace of life, excitement and the individual. 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Saturday, March 7, 2020 4:51 PM

Oh man Vince, you bring up some brilliant points.  That great way to travel, and now all gone.  Why, indeed why?

Well, I think I have an answer, and in fact it goes back to the days of trans-oceanic travel and applies to trains as well.

While there have always been those who've travelled for pleasure, travel for most people involved something they had  to do, not something they wanted  to do.  Whether it was for business, emigration from one part of a country to another or from one country to another travel was a burden.  Ocean liners used to be furnished like floating hotels (depending on your class of course) because people didn't want to reminded they were on a ship and trains were the same, and since there was competition between carriers involved it made good business sense to make the trip as pleasureable as possible.  But the big selling point was speed, speed to get you from Point A to Point B as rapidly as possible.  It's why sail gave way to steam, and on land stagecoaches and canal boats gave way to railroads.  Speed was the selling point.  It always has been.

And then, affordable air transportation came along.  Considering the tremendously shortened travel times the traveling public didn't mind being sealed in an aluminum tube and shot through the sky.  And even in the beginning considering the competition the airlines tried to make the process as enjoyable as possible.

Now?  Well, we can say the airlines have a monopoly on long distance travel so they don't have to try as hard to get the business.  Paranoia over terrorism has made the process even more of a hassle.  (Do you think any terrorist is going to try and hijack an airliner anymore?  Seriously?  They'd be torn apart by enraged passengers, no-ones just going to sit in their seats anymore and just take it.  The authorities would pick up what's left of Mr. Terrorist in a Glad bag!)   Short-distance travel, you might as well drive.  The airlines don't want that business (most of 'em anyway) and Amtrak can't figure out how to get it.

Maybe that old world will come back if enough people are interested enough, but I'm not going to hold my breath.  Times change, not necessarily for the better. 

And if teleportation (Beam me up Scotty!) ever becomes a reality, kiss the airlines goodby.  

Ah well, as Dr. Suess once said, "Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened!"  

PS:  Slight correction, stagecoaches are still around, but instead of saying "Wells Fargo" on the side now they say "Greyhound" or "Megabus."  But jeez, who wants to travel by bus?  Not me!

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