Classic Railroad Quiz (at least 50 years old).

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Posted by Deggesty on Saturday, March 14, 2009 9:12 PM
wanswheel

Johnny, the word metropolis, New York is definitely that. A sleeper to Niagara Falls?

No, you can get farther from Washington State than New York. Look ahead....

Johnny

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Posted by wanswheel on Sunday, March 15, 2009 12:02 AM

Of course. I read it as possibly Seattle is about as far from a New York train as you can get, and not necessarily the train is as far from Washington State as you can get, which puts it in Florida.  No idea.

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Posted by KCSfan on Sunday, March 15, 2009 4:30 AM

Deggesty

No, you can get farther from Washington State than New York. Look ahead....

Johnny

Johnny,

Now we're getting somewhere. Look Ahead, Look South puts us on the Southern Rwy. I believe the car would be the Atlanta - Brunswick sleeper carried in the KC-Fla Special between Atl and Jesup and then on the 40 miles to Brunswick in an unnamed connecting train headed probably by a GP road switcher.

Mark

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Posted by Deggesty on Sunday, March 15, 2009 5:35 PM

KCSfan

Now we're getting somewhere. Look Ahead, Look South puts us on the Southern Rwy. I believe the car would be the Atlanta - Brunswick sleeper carried in the KC-Fla Special between Atl and Jesup and then on the 40 miles to Brunswick in an unnamed connecting train headed probably by a GP road switcher.

Mark, you have the sleeper line, complete with the name of the name train. The 10-1-65 Southern timetable shows the car; the 5-1-66 timetable does not. I really had another type of engine in mind, but I will accept your answer, for Dave Morgan mentioned the engine in his article in the January 1965 issue of Trains, stating that it was a Geep. By then, the train no longer went to Jacksonville, but was strictly a Birmingham-Brunswick train on the Southern with a through coach between Kansas City and Brunswick!

If I had had the wherewithal on New Year's night 1962, I would have asked about a berth from Jesup to Atlanta in this car. Instead, I spent most of the night in an unheated washroom in a Frisco coach, since the coaches were filled with people returning from the New Year's Day football games in Florida. (The night before, I had two facing seats all to myself as I went down to Jesup.)

Mark, you have the next question.

Johnny

 

 

 

Johnny

 

Jan 65 Traisn

Johnny

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Posted by KCSfan on Sunday, March 15, 2009 6:24 PM

Johnny,

Ahaa, it's hard to fool us old timers. I imagine most readers don't remember when the Southern used to advertise "Look Ahead, Look South". As soon as I spotted that disguised hint I knew the railroad and the 40 mile distance from Jesup to Brunswick made the rest of the answer easy. But until now I had no idea that through cars continued to run to Brunswick after the KC-Fla Spcl was discontinued into Jacksonville.

Your tale about riding in an unheated coach restroom reminded me of a trip I took on the Georgian in mid-winter 1948 or 49. The weather was almost balmy when I boarded the train in Atlanta but it was absolutely frigid by the time we reached northern Illinois. I had a call of nature that couldn't be denied as the train left Danville on the C&EI so I headed for the men's room which turned out to be unheated. The toilet outlet was frozen in a partially opened position which exposed me to a blast of Icy air as we sped along. I thought I was going to freeze to the seat and was never so cold except one night on bivouac in mid-winter when I was a basic trainee at Ft. Leonard Wood, MO.

So much for the war stories. I'm heading to my daughter's for her 49th birthday and will try to have another question in mind by the time I get back tonight.

Mark

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Posted by Deggesty on Sunday, March 15, 2009 6:47 PM

Deggesty

Jan 65 Traisn

If anyone is wondering about the reference to the January 1965 Trains, that issue has quite an article by Dave Morgan in which he describes the trip he and his wife took in the Brunswick-Atlanta car in the summer of '64. I forgot to mention the article in my previous post on this thread.

Mark, we will wait for you on this thread.

Johnny

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, March 16, 2009 8:29 AM

In the 1960's a certain railroad ran two identical trains over two different routes which had one common end point, Headed by a single E unit, their three car consists were a baggage/mail/express car, a single coach and a round end coach/cafe/tavern lounge observation car. All cars were streamlined lightweights. At their common end point they were combined and additional cars were added to form a name train that ran on to a third destination. Going in the opposite direction this procedure was reversed to split the name train into the two little streamliners. What was the railroad, the end points of all three trains and the name train involved in this service?

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Posted by henry6 on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 7:31 PM

Atlantic Coast Line East and West Coast Champions.  Jacksonville the split from the north.

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Posted by KCSfan on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 7:53 PM

Sorry Henry but no cigar. The consists of the Champions were nuch bigger than the three cars of these two streamliners.

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Posted by Deggesty on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 10:00 PM

Mark, can you give us a hint as to what area in the country these trains were operated?

Johnny

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Posted by KCSfan on Wednesday, March 18, 2009 1:48 AM

Without being too specific I'll just say they ran in the Central Time Zone. The railroad they ran on was passenger friendly. They had eliminated the need for a first class ticket in their sleepers - just a coach ticket and charge for the space occupied was all that was necessary. They also were promoting train travel in paid newspaper ads throughout their service area as late as 1966.

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Posted by KCSfan on Wednesday, March 18, 2009 10:05 AM

I've been wondering why this question seems to be such a challenge particularly to some of you who I think of as experts when it comes to passenger trains in the golden age of railroading. It just occurred to me that these questions are supposed to harken back to at least 50 years ago which would be 1959 or prior. The schedule which is the subject of my question may not have been started until sometime in the 1960's which would make the question invalid and might be the reason you are having difficulty answering it. I can only state with certainty that the schedule was in effect in 1965 until the end of passenger service on this particular railroad.

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Posted by Deggesty on Thursday, March 19, 2009 11:19 AM

KCSfan

Without being too specific I'll just say they ran in the Central Time Zone. The railroad they ran on was passenger friendly. They had eliminated the need for a first class ticket in their sleepers - just a coach ticket and charge for the space occupied was all that was necessary. They also were promoting train travel in paid newspaper ads throughout their service area as late as 1966.

Mark

Mark, the only road I can think of is the KCS--whose last passenger train was the Southern Belle. It did operate the Flying Crow with a sleeper between Kansas City and Shreveport, with through equipment to New Orleans. I rode it several times between Baton Rouge and New Orleans and, once, from Shreveport to Baton Rouge, enjoying the view to the rear from the observation car every time (except the first time up, when there was no observation car on it). I am not sure about a through coach to Port Arthur; there may have been one when, about 1954, the KCS changed the schedule of the Southern Belle from being a mid-afternoon to mid-morning schedule between New Orleans and KC, with through cars to Port Arthur. As I recall, in September of of '68, when I took the Southern Belle all the way from New Orleans to KC, 15/9-10/16 had been cut off., for I had to take a bus between New Orleans and Baton Rouge to visit my brother (I was not going to have him meet nor take me to a midnight train).

Johnny

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Posted by KCSfan on Friday, March 20, 2009 7:22 AM

Johnny,

You've got it almost right. Close enough to be declared the winner. In the latter years of passenger service the Southern Belle left Kansas City in the morning and ran through to New Orleans arriving early the next morning. The Flying Crow ran overnight between Kansas City and Shreveport carrying a sleeper, coaches and diner/lounge.  South of Shreveport the Crow was split into the two little  three cars streamliners. One made a daytime run to New Orleans and the the other to Port Arthur, TX. Going north the coaches from NO nad PA  were combined at Shreveport, the diner and the diner and sleeper added to become the Flying Crow for the overnight run back to KC.

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Posted by Deggesty on Friday, March 20, 2009 11:52 AM

KCSfan

Johnny,

You've got it almost right. Close enough to be declared the winner. In the latter years of passenger service the Southern Belle left Kansas City in the morning and ran through to New Orleans arriving early the next morning. The Flying Crow ran overnight between Kansas City and Shreveport carrying a sleeper, coaches and diner/lounge.  South of Shreveport the Crow was split into the two little  three cars streamliners. One made a daytime run to New Orleans and the the other to Port Arthur, TX. Going north the coaches from NO nad PA  were combined at Shreveport, the diner and the diner and sleeper added to become the Flying Crow for the overnight run back to KC.

Mark 

Thanks, Mark. When I rode 9 and 10 (1960-67), there were usually two coaches as well as the observation-dinette-lounge. Also, in the last few years the train was operated in Port Arthur, the timetable indicated that there was not a through coach to/from KC.

When the Southern Belle was the only passenger train left on the KCS, the observation combo served as the diner for the full run.

Here is a question: what  town in Arkansas was named for a queen, and who was the railroad builder who named the town? (The name of the town uses only two syllables of the queen's four syllable name.)

Johnny

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Posted by KCSfan on Friday, March 20, 2009 2:02 PM

Deggesty

Here is a question: what  town in Arkansas was named for a queen, and who was the railroad builder who named the town? (The name of the town uses only two syllables of the queen's four syllable name.)

Johnny

Johnny,

The town would be Mena named for Queen Wilamena of the Netherlands. A few miles up the mountain from the town lies the Queen Wilamena State Park. Gorgeous country and we've stayed at the park lodge there several times. The Talihamena Drive from Mena up the mountain to the park and on to Oklahoma traverses some rugged country. At the AR-OK state line there stands an old survey marker dating back to a time before OK was a state. It reads Arkansas on one side and Indian Territory on  the other. I believe the builder who named the town would be Arthur Stillwell who, with the backing of Dutch financial interests, constructed and acquired other railroads to form a goodly portion of what today is the KCS.

Mark 

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Posted by Deggesty on Friday, March 20, 2009 2:53 PM

KCSfan

The town would be Mena named for Queen Wilamena of the Netherlands. A few miles up the mountain from the town lies the Queen Wilamena State Park. Gorgeous country and we've stayed at the park lodge there several times. The Talihamena Drive from Mena up the mountain to the park and on to Oklahoma traverses some rugged country. At the AR-OK state line there stands an old survey marker dating back to a time before OK was a state. It reads Arkansas on one side and Indian Territory on  the other. I believe the builder who named the town would be Arthur Stillwell who, with the backing of Dutch financial interests, constructed and acquired other railroads to form a goodly portion of what today is the KCS.

Mark 

Yes, Mark, I thought you would know this one Now you have another opportunity to ask a question.

Johnny

 

Johnny

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Posted by KCSfan on Friday, March 20, 2009 4:41 PM

The depot in his hometown was often used by Jimmy Carter as a backdrop in his campaign for the presidency. Up until 1951, when passenger service was discontinued, the train that stopped there ran between what two cities over what railroad? For extra credit, what motive power was used on this run in its latter years of operation?

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Posted by KCSfan on Sunday, March 22, 2009 2:55 AM

Here's a hint for you. This train ran through the heart of the south.

Mark

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Posted by al-in-chgo on Sunday, March 22, 2009 2:26 PM

KCSfan

Here's a hint for you. This train ran through the heart of the south.

Mark

Atlanta - Tallahassee?   -   a.s.

 

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Posted by KCSfan on Sunday, March 22, 2009 4:06 PM

Sorry Al but no cigar for you yet. This trains route ran through two states but Florida was not one of them.

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, March 23, 2009 6:00 PM

"Through the Heart of the South" refers not only to the route of the train but was also the long time slogan of the RR that served Carter's home town.

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Posted by al-in-chgo on Monday, March 23, 2009 6:19 PM

KCSfan

"Through the Heart of the South" refers not only to the route of the train but was also the long time slogan of the RR that served Carter's home town.

Mark

SAL?  - a.s.

 

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, March 23, 2009 6:32 PM

al-in-chgo

KCSfan

"Through the Heart of the South" refers not only to the route of the train but was also the long time slogan of the RR that served Carter's home town.

Mark

SAL?  - a.s.

Right RR Al. You get to light your cigar when you name which of the Seaboard's routes passed through this town.

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Posted by al-in-chgo on Monday, March 23, 2009 6:42 PM

Uh oh.  WAG time again:  Raleigh to Mobile?  -  a.s.

 

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Posted by KCSfan on Monday, March 23, 2009 7:34 PM

al-in-chgo

Uh oh.  WAG time again:  Raleigh to Mobile?  -  a.s.

Sorry Al but the Seaboard never ran to Mobile. River Jct (Chattahoochee, Fl) where it turned the Gulf Wind over to the L&N for the remainder of its run to New Orleans was the closest it got to Mobile. Another city which was one terminal of the subject route was the next clodsest point to Mobile on the SAL. Also the subject route only ran through two states. Raleigh to Mobile would have taken it through four states, NC, SC, GA and AL.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 6:14 AM

Didn't Carter use his home town depot as a prop, Plains?   The SAL did use the slogan "Through the Heart of the South."   I didn't know they ran through Plains, however or what route it might be.  The Seabord had a two-state route between Atlanta and Bermingham (GA and LA) and one passenger train was local between the two, rode it, and then there was the Silver Comet, through, Birmingham - NYC.

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Posted by wanswheel on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 9:25 AM
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Posted by KCSfan on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 9:51 AM

daveklepper

Didn't Carter use his home town depot as a prop, Plains?   The SAL did use the slogan "Through the Heart of the South."   I didn't know they ran through Plains, however or what route it might be.  The Seabord had a two-state route between Atlanta and Bermingham (GA and LA) and one passenger train was local between the two, rode it, and then there was the Silver Comet, through, Birmingham - NYC.

Dave,

Right town, right RR, but wrong route, so no cigar. You're warm so try again.

Mark

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Posted by KCSfan on Saturday, March 28, 2009 10:21 AM

KCSfan

daveklepper

Didn't Carter use his home town depot as a prop, Plains?   The SAL did use the slogan "Through the Heart of the South."   I didn't know they ran through Plains, however or what route it might be.  The Seabord had a two-state route between Atlanta and Bermingham (GA and LA) and one passenger train was local between the two, rode it, and then there was the Silver Comet, through, Birmingham - NYC.

Dave,

Right town, right RR, but wrong route, so no cigar. You're warm so try again.

Mark

Dave,

You've even got the two states, GA and AL right. Just think of two other large cities in these states that the SAL served and you've got the route.

Mark

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