Mark Meyer
QUOTE: , so a lot of the seats were witohut windows
QUOTE: Originally posted by davide80 , what is a "section car"? Sections refer to open sections, which are the upper and lower berths that are commonly associated with travel by sleeping car. They are "open" in the sense that only a curtain separates the beds from the aisle. Probably the most common sleeping car floor plan in the heavyweight era was 12 sections and 1 drawing room. The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, July 27, 2005 7:50 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by CSSHEGEWISCH QUOTE: Originally posted by davide80 , what is a "section car"? Sections refer to open sections, which are the upper and lower berths that are commonly associated with travel by sleeping car. They are "open" in the sense that only a curtain separates the beds from the aisle. Probably the most common sleeping car floor plan in the heavyweight era was 12 sections and 1 drawing room. Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. CSSHEGEWISCH answered your question. Private rooms were generally unpopular in the US until the advent of the lightweight all-room cars in the 1930's. Lots of reasons, many of which revolved around what many straightlaced Americans thought went on behind the closed doors of the private rooms. It didn't help that one of the pioneer all-room car designs in the late 1800's was Mann's "Boudoir Car", a name that conjured up all kinds of naughty speculation about what the decadent European lifestyle implicit in the name might do to poison the heretofore squeaky clean (!) egalitarian American sensibilities.[}:)][}:)] Consequently, well over 90% of the Pullman heavyweight fleet incorporated open sections (upper and lower berths) as their primary accommodation. As CSSHEGEWISCH says, the most popular was the 12-1 arrangement, but there were also loads of 14 and 16 section cars, many of which were retired, but quite a few were converted to tourist cars in the 1930's, and then to troop sleepers and hospital cars in WWII. Particularly after the war, these cars could be had for next to nothing (including the tourist cars, as that market dried up), and with the popularity of the modern long distance air-conditioned reclining seat coach, they became prime candidates for conversion to coaches. It also helped that they had big lounges and restrooms at each end, which fit right in with the accommodation plan, and the windows were the right arrangement. It also didn't hurt that the Pullman antitrust case prompted release of the fleet to the private RRs in 1947. Consequently quite a few 14's and 16's, as well as some 12-1's went to the RR's and were rebuilt as chair cars instead of being scrapped. A few more were rebuilt as baggage and mail storage cars. For example Katy had a bunch of these starting in about 1954. Hope this helps.. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, August 3, 2005 5:57 AM drephpe, thank you for your detailed answer. I didn't know anything about this type of cars. And I also think there had never been cars like these in the country I live in (Italy). Bye Davide Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, August 5, 2005 3:49 AM and he notes - The Boston & Maine converted several sleepers to baggage cars. They had plated over windows, added baggage doors and retained their vestibules. I remember seeing them in back in the 50s in Nashua, NH on the "Paper Train", a 3:00 a.m. accommodation that ran from Boston, Mass. to Concord, NH and then split with one section going on to White River Jct., Vt. and the other to Woodsville, NH. In later years, the train dropped the baggage cars at Concord and an E Unit and a single coach went on to White River Jct. and a BL2 and another coach continued to Plymouth, NH. All were dismantled or sold during the McGinnis era. Reply Edit daveklepper Member sinceJune 2002 20,025 posts Posted by daveklepper on Monday, August 8, 2005 10:03 AM Other conversions included the section sleepers of the California Zephyr owned by all three railroads that we converted to non-dome coaches and still operated as overflow and protection equipment for the California Zephyr, with two continuing on the Rio Grande Zephyr. When the NYNH&H got its post WWII lightweight Pullman, stainless steel sided parlor and parlor baggage cars it converted its six-wheel truck heavyweight parlors to high-capacity commuter coaches, replacing the New York Westchester and Boston ex-multiple unit cars that had replaced the open platform wood cars in the late 30's. These ex-parlors were the first air-conditioned commuter cars in the Boston area. They lasted until the Old Colony abandonements. On all the conversions, a tell-tale sign was the windows that did not match the seating. Reply SUBSCRIBER & MEMBER LOGIN Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! Login Register FREE NEWSLETTER SIGNUP Get the Classic Trains twice-monthly newsletter Submit More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
, what is a "section car"?
QUOTE: Originally posted by CSSHEGEWISCH QUOTE: Originally posted by davide80 , what is a "section car"? Sections refer to open sections, which are the upper and lower berths that are commonly associated with travel by sleeping car. They are "open" in the sense that only a curtain separates the beds from the aisle. Probably the most common sleeping car floor plan in the heavyweight era was 12 sections and 1 drawing room. Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. CSSHEGEWISCH answered your question. Private rooms were generally unpopular in the US until the advent of the lightweight all-room cars in the 1930's. Lots of reasons, many of which revolved around what many straightlaced Americans thought went on behind the closed doors of the private rooms. It didn't help that one of the pioneer all-room car designs in the late 1800's was Mann's "Boudoir Car", a name that conjured up all kinds of naughty speculation about what the decadent European lifestyle implicit in the name might do to poison the heretofore squeaky clean (!) egalitarian American sensibilities.[}:)][}:)] Consequently, well over 90% of the Pullman heavyweight fleet incorporated open sections (upper and lower berths) as their primary accommodation. As CSSHEGEWISCH says, the most popular was the 12-1 arrangement, but there were also loads of 14 and 16 section cars, many of which were retired, but quite a few were converted to tourist cars in the 1930's, and then to troop sleepers and hospital cars in WWII. Particularly after the war, these cars could be had for next to nothing (including the tourist cars, as that market dried up), and with the popularity of the modern long distance air-conditioned reclining seat coach, they became prime candidates for conversion to coaches. It also helped that they had big lounges and restrooms at each end, which fit right in with the accommodation plan, and the windows were the right arrangement. It also didn't hurt that the Pullman antitrust case prompted release of the fleet to the private RRs in 1947. Consequently quite a few 14's and 16's, as well as some 12-1's went to the RR's and were rebuilt as chair cars instead of being scrapped. A few more were rebuilt as baggage and mail storage cars. For example Katy had a bunch of these starting in about 1954. Hope this helps.. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, August 3, 2005 5:57 AM drephpe, thank you for your detailed answer. I didn't know anything about this type of cars. And I also think there had never been cars like these in the country I live in (Italy). Bye Davide Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, August 5, 2005 3:49 AM and he notes - The Boston & Maine converted several sleepers to baggage cars. They had plated over windows, added baggage doors and retained their vestibules. I remember seeing them in back in the 50s in Nashua, NH on the "Paper Train", a 3:00 a.m. accommodation that ran from Boston, Mass. to Concord, NH and then split with one section going on to White River Jct., Vt. and the other to Woodsville, NH. In later years, the train dropped the baggage cars at Concord and an E Unit and a single coach went on to White River Jct. and a BL2 and another coach continued to Plymouth, NH. All were dismantled or sold during the McGinnis era. Reply Edit daveklepper Member sinceJune 2002 20,025 posts Posted by daveklepper on Monday, August 8, 2005 10:03 AM Other conversions included the section sleepers of the California Zephyr owned by all three railroads that we converted to non-dome coaches and still operated as overflow and protection equipment for the California Zephyr, with two continuing on the Rio Grande Zephyr. When the NYNH&H got its post WWII lightweight Pullman, stainless steel sided parlor and parlor baggage cars it converted its six-wheel truck heavyweight parlors to high-capacity commuter coaches, replacing the New York Westchester and Boston ex-multiple unit cars that had replaced the open platform wood cars in the late 30's. These ex-parlors were the first air-conditioned commuter cars in the Boston area. They lasted until the Old Colony abandonements. On all the conversions, a tell-tale sign was the windows that did not match the seating. Reply SUBSCRIBER & MEMBER LOGIN Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! Login Register FREE NEWSLETTER SIGNUP Get the Classic Trains twice-monthly newsletter Submit More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
QUOTE: Originally posted by davide80 , what is a "section car"? Sections refer to open sections, which are the upper and lower berths that are commonly associated with travel by sleeping car. They are "open" in the sense that only a curtain separates the beds from the aisle. Probably the most common sleeping car floor plan in the heavyweight era was 12 sections and 1 drawing room.
Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!
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