An E-4 in Omaha

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An E-4 in Omaha
Posted by M636C on Sunday, August 9, 2020 10:20 PM

I don't know if others waste their time looking at the historical photo site "Shorpy" but occasionally interesting Railroad photos appear.

https://www.shorpy.com/node/25807?size=_original#caption is one of those.

It appears that an E-4 4-6-4 has arrived (presumably from Chicago) and is switching the mail cars from its train. The locomotive is fairly new and still has the nose coupler covers in place.

However, can anyone identify the two switch locomotives waiting on the lower level on the left of the photo?

Peter

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Posted by Miningman on Sunday, August 9, 2020 11:33 PM

I'll leave it to the ex-spurts but that pic is a great find. I've been lost in it for the last ten minutes. I truly remember when my world looked like that, not the same, but the same look, the same feeling, which to me as a kid was better than great. Love the old wooden fences and the multiple tracks. 

Taking a wild guess I say CB&Q only because of the silver faces. Maybe Union Pacific did the same. 

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, August 10, 2020 5:01 AM

That is a truly heroic amount of steam rising from the boiler, without what I'd think would be the jet structure of pop safeties lifting to produce that appearance of mass flow.  I see no visible exhaust, so the engine is likely not moving, and I wonder what combination of circumstances would put it stopped with the consist separated with the fire kept high enough and no compensating use of feed water injection to take the waste of steam down...

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, August 10, 2020 8:23 AM

I think Miningman is right about CB&Q, though it could also be Rock Island.  The switchers are on some now-long-gone industrial tracks west of UP's station.

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Posted by M636C on Monday, August 10, 2020 9:21 AM

Overmod

That is a truly heroic amount of steam rising from the boiler, without what I'd think would be the jet structure of pop safeties lifting to produce that appearance of mass flow.  I see no visible exhaust, so the engine is likely not moving, and I wonder what combination of circumstances would put it stopped with the consist separated with the fire kept high enough and no compensating use of feed water injection to take the waste of steam down...

 

It wasn't a one-off...

Here is a view where the train (the Forty Niner in this case) was stopped for an official photo. It may have been backing in to Chicago or it may have been hauled out of the station for the photo. Either way, the same steam, presumably from the safety valves. My E-4 diagram suggests that the whistle is also just behind the steam dome. It could be a whistle in the Omaha photo, but not in the Chicago shot, since the driver is waiting for a signal from the photographer...

Peter

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Monday, August 10, 2020 11:07 AM

Anyone notice the different varieties of coal for sale in the "Co-Muny" coal yard, from "regular" to "extra-chunky?"  Interesting.

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Posted by Jones1945 on Monday, August 10, 2020 3:07 PM

According to Steamlocomotive.com:

"Their "physical attributes" were very similar to the Milwaukee's F-7s, which were also built by Alco in the same year (Locobase 183). One striking internal difference: The E-4 had only eight 2-inch tubes, which together with the 196 3 3/4" flues, made up much of her heating surface. This ratio of tube to flue is almost as far away from the usual balance as a standard boiler could get. By comparison, the F-7s had 220 more square feet, divided among 60 2 1/4" tubes and 164 3 1/2" flues, a more typical arrangement. The E-4s also had a 9% larger grate."

It sounds like CNW's E-4 was not as good as MILW's F7 in terms of design and performance. I wonder why CNW or Alco didn't use the same spec of MILW class F7 for the CNW E-4? Was it because the spec of MILW F7 was a trade secret, therefore Alco couldn't build the E-4 with a completely identical spec?  

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Posted by pennytrains on Monday, August 10, 2020 7:30 PM

Ummmm.....when I click on the link I got this picture:

https://www.shorpy.com/node/25807?size=_original#caption

Big Smile  Same me, different spelling!  Big Smile

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, August 10, 2020 7:55 PM

You'll have to scroll to the right or reduce the size of the picture to see the E-4. 

On the switchers I'm liking Rock Island more...

https://ctr.trains.com/railroad-reference/locomotives/2006/07/steam-locomotive-profile-0-6-0

Also Rock Island shared the UP station.  CB&Q was on the other side of the E-4.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Monday, August 10, 2020 8:20 PM

I love the "Broken Aro (Arrow?) Coal".  Looks like the coal was hand unloaded at the stub siding.  If a model railroader modeled it, it would probably be regarded as fanciful without prototype.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Monday, August 10, 2020 9:36 PM

MidlandMike
If a model railroader modeled it, it would probably be regarded as fanciful without prototype.

Never say never as far as the real world is concerned.  You can say unlikely,  but never say never.  

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Posted by Miningman on Monday, August 10, 2020 10:07 PM

Thinking you are quite correct rcdrye...sure looks like it in that pic... the stack is maybe higher in the new pic but the original is a long range pic.  CB&Q being on the other side of C&NW would rule them out. So let's call it the good old Rock Island. 

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Posted by Miningman on Monday, August 10, 2020 10:50 PM

 Penny: The picture

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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 1:25 AM

For those interested in the photographer ... John Vachon...quite interesting 

 
 
Grain elevators in Omaha by John Vachon
 
Days of Grace by John Vachon
 
 
 
 
 

 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 8:53 AM

I thought that was Marilyn!  Lucky guy!

John Vachon's photos in "Days of Grace" remind me a lot of one of my favorite artists of Americana Eric Sloane.  Have a look...

http://www.artnet.com/artists/eric-sloane/  

I love that shot of the kid with the Savage combo gun! Certainly on his way to do a little huntin'.  Imagine seeing a kid in this day and age walking down the street with a gun?  There'd be multiple panic buttons pushed!  

A saner day and time.

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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 3:07 PM


It ain't over till the fat lady sings 

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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 3:11 PM

 

John Vachon's fellow passengers waiting for the train to Minneapolis at East Dubuque, Illinois

( surprise ending!) ... imagine yourself on the platform people watching and then look what shows up! 

 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 5:24 PM

Those John Vachon photos are priceless!

Yeah, it sure wasn't "Flyover Country" back in those days, unseen and unthought of.  Anyone traveling cross-country by train in those days saw  the country, and as a rail writer once put it at every stop "A little bit of your country got on board."

Jet travel gets us where we need to be a lot quicker, but something's been irretrievably lost with the "progress."

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, August 12, 2020 2:00 AM

And to keep it from disappearing completely, I'll stay with promoting the station restaurant scheme. unless someone comes up with a better idea.

And what works in Europe or in 1st Class in airlines, may be highly subsidized, and thus not a solution.

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Posted by jeffhergert on Friday, October 30, 2020 9:14 AM

Miningman

Thinking you are quite correct rcdrye...sure looks like it in that pic... the stack is maybe higher in the new pic but the original is a long range pic.  CB&Q being on the other side of C&NW would rule them out. So let's call it the good old Rock Island. 

 

I would say if they aren't UP, they might be Missouri Pacific.  That double track line wound it's way back to the maze of yards that are long gone that was UP and  MP.  Even though Omaha was a far corner of the MP, they had more of a presence there than most people realize. 

All's left is a stub track, that doesn't make it as far as where the locomotives are at of one of the mains.  It's a switchback to access a couple of customers, one being a lumber yard that is most active.  (The other gets in steel, but not too often going by observation.

Some of those track beds are now access roads.  One for Tower B, which still exists in whole, now MOW/signal offices.  (Towers A and C only have their first floors left.)  I often get cabbed up the access road (you go beyond the turn for the tower) to 20th Street to get trains coming up from Kansas City.

Jeff 

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