Love/Hate Relationship

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Love/Hate Relationship
Posted by SPer on Thursday, October 05, 2017 3:58 PM

why did Santa Fe loves diesel-electric locomotives and hated steam locomotives

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Posted by Firelock76 on Thursday, October 05, 2017 7:15 PM

I wouldn't say Santa Fe hated steam locomotives, far from it.  Look how many were donated to various communitys along the way.  That would indicate to me they were quite proud of them.

However, sheer practicality had to win out in the end, so steam had to go.

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Posted by Deggesty on Thursday, October 05, 2017 7:18 PM

What did the Santa Fe have against steam locomotives? Steam engines required a lot of water--and alkaline water is not good for boilers.

Johnny

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Posted by Firelock76 on Thursday, October 05, 2017 9:02 PM

Deggesty

What did the Santa Fe have against steam locomotives? Steam engines required a lot of water--and alkaline water is not good for boilers.

 

Deggesty

What did the Santa Fe have against steam locomotives? Steam engines required a lot of water--and alkaline water is not good for boilers.

 

And of course, there's no coal where the Santa Fe ran, or in most places where they ran, so they burned oil as soon as it was practical.

But if you're going to use oil as a fuel, it makes sense to use it in the most efficient way possible, so it's back to diesels again.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Friday, October 06, 2017 10:19 AM

Santa Fe's relatively early dieselization was in part a function of the territory it served.  Santa Fe was able to get so many FT's during wartime because they were better suited for operations in the Arizona desert.

Why does the OP keep beating this dead horse? Confused

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by selector on Friday, October 06, 2017 10:45 AM

SPer

why did Santa Fe loves diesel-electric locomotives and hated steam locomotives

 

Why is the moon purple?  If I ask the question, the listener is forced to either answer as if the underlying premise is correct (ie, the moon IS purple), or to reject it and to say the question is unanswerable. It happens to be that the question I posed is unanswerable.  It happens that your question is also unanswerable because I must reject your premise prima facie.

Perhaps you would be good enough to point to a credible source, other than your assertion, that supports your premise.  From there we might be able to engage in something approximating a discussion.

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Posted by SPer on Friday, October 06, 2017 12:21 PM

that's why Santa Fe stopped using steam locomotives in freight service in 1953 to become a all-diesel-electric road and never looked back

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Posted by DSchmitt on Friday, October 06, 2017 2:12 PM

All US railroads switched to diesels and never looked back. Some earlier, some later.

I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.

I don't have a leg to stand on.

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Posted by SPer on Friday, October 06, 2017 3:45 PM

So when Santa Fe officially ended steam in 1953 and what steam locomotive.

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Posted by selector on Friday, October 06, 2017 4:38 PM

http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WMFF74_Last_Steam_Locomotive_Run_on_the_Santa_fe_Railroad

The above may be incomplete and misleading as it doesn't say that 3759 was the last steam locomotive to run revenue service for the Santa Fe.  However, one could conclude that the railroad's 4-8-4's were used until the end, and an educated guess says their wonderful 2-10-4 and 4-6-4 variants were also used until near the very last in 1953.  You'd need a history of the Santa Fe to get a definitive answer.

As an example of how your date of 1953 could be wrong, see the following:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Fe_5017 

...meaning that freight probably lasted somewhat longer because sure as aitch that locomotive wasn't hauling the Chief.

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Posted by Trinity River Bottoms Boomer on Saturday, October 07, 2017 7:41 AM

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Santa Fe's last stand with steam when it sent several 2-10-4's to the Pennsy for duty in Ohio during the autumn of 1956.  Visit www.columbusrailroads.com

 

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Posted by Firelock76 on Saturday, October 07, 2017 11:42 AM

TRBB, you're absolutely correct!  Those Santa Fe 2-10-4's leased to the PRR were well-liked by those Pennsy crewmen who ran them too.

I guess no-one's mentioned it because it was a short episode, easily forgotten except by Pennsy and Santa Fe fans.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, October 09, 2017 9:18 AM

I still consider the Ripley Sante Fe 2-10-4's the very best non-articulated freight power with the Pennsy and C&O 2-10-4s a very very close second.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Friday, October 13, 2017 8:30 PM

When did Santa Fe last run steam?

Well, this is from an article in "Classic Trains" Special Edition "Steam Glory 3" from 2012.  It's from an article called "Insiders View Of Santa Fe Steam" by Jack Elwood, an SF veteran who began railroading in 1939.  I'll quote Mr. Elwood directly...

"The curtain came down on Santa Fe steam in August 1957.  The last stand of the great 4-8-4's and 2-10-4's took place in New Mexico, in  helper service between Belen and Mountainair.  These engines were only 13 years old and had many more years left in their service life. Some of us at the time were confounded at the decision to scrap these engines, especially when I recalled that the first steam locomotive I worked on in Santa Fe service was 40 years old at the time.  It was unprecedented for engines to be scrapped at such a young age."

Indeed!  I'm sure Mr. Elwood had plenty of company!

Great article.  In fact, the whole special issue is a keeper.  I believe it's still available as a back-issue from Kalmbach.

 

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Posted by SPer on Saturday, October 14, 2017 3:19 PM

Santa Fe would have follow in the footsteps of Southern,Rock Island,Cotton Belt,Western Pacific,and Delaware and Hudson by ending steam in 1953, It could take Santa Fe 84 years to put out this fire

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Posted by Fr.Al on Wednesday, October 18, 2017 6:51 PM

The Rutland also ended steam in 1953, but oddly enough had purchased 4 4-8-2s in 1946, when hardly any railroads were ordering steam locomotives.

    But as far as Santa Fe goes, let's quote Lucius Beebe from "Highball" . "Before Diesel operation it was necessary to transport three million gallons of water a day to one point." I'll let anyone interested do their own research.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Thursday, October 19, 2017 10:24 AM

The point in question is Hackberry, Arizona.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul

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