In the recent Classic Trains there is a photo of Soo Line's Mountaineer with an eclectic collection of sleeping cars belonging to other carriers. Even though Soo mostly ran its own sleepers it had some kind of contract with Pullman - at least their cars were listed in Pullmans car lists. Train partner Canadian Pacific ran its own sleepers but had a few cars listed in the Pullman lists. Looking for other examples of wandering sleepers - especially personal experience stories.
The "Mountaineer" photo was listed as late 1950s or early 1960s. To the best of my knowledge 1960 was the last year of Portal operation for through cars, and my August 1960 OG only lists an 8 sec 1 DR 2 Cpt car. The only car I could conclusively ID from the photo was a UP "Western" 12 Rmt 4 DBR car, though the CB&Q car is either a 10-6 or a 6DBR 5 Cpt. I'm thinking the photo might represent a special movement.
Rob:
My guess is that the cars in your photo were a special move. I have never heard of the SOO operating a "Pullman" on their trains, only SOO cars.
A July, 1948 OG shows through sleeping cars from Chicago on the CNW-St. Paul-SOO-Portal CP. The OG does not list whether those cars are SOO or Pullman, although it would seem strange that the CNW would haul SOO owned and operated sleeping cars on their trains.
Ed Burns
Soo Line and Wisconsin Central cars were listed in Pullman's car lists. There was one interline Pullman move (with CMStP&P) from Chicago to Sault Ste Marie that lasted until at least 1958. (The Soo also inherited DSS&A's piece of the Copper Country Ltd in 1960, but that was really a CMStP&P train.) There were a couple of CP-owned cars in the 1950 Pullman list, and CP did run some Pullman lines in earlier years with B&M and NYC. Toronto cars off of NYC trains via both Detroit and Buffalo were Pullman operated until NYC dropped Pullman in 1958. My guess is that Soo had access to Pullman's pool for summer overflow on regular trains and summer camp special trains.
In considering the Mountaineer photo I would guess also that the non-Soo/CP sleepers had Pullman attendants - I can't see Soo Line having enough of an extra list and CP's would have been consumed elsewhere.
My guess is that Amtrak leased the car temporarily from Southern, but the attendent wore an Amtrak uniiform and worked for Amtrak,, not Southern.
ACYIn 1972, I was visiting friends in Washington DC when Hurricane Agnes hit, and I was on the first westbound run of the C&O/PC Amtrak train, taking me home to Chicago. The train was called the James Whitcomb Riley at the time, if I remember correctly. SR was still operating its trains independently, and had not joined Amtrak. Arriving at Washington Union Station, I was surprised and amused to see that my roomette was in a Southern Railway sleeper! I have no idea why that car was on an Amtrak train, and I have no idea who was paying the Attendant. I do know the Attendant got off the train at Cincinnati & was relieved by a new Attendant who worked the car to Chicago, and I always regretted the fact that the first man got off before I had a chance to tip him. After that, I understood that some car assignments were much more flexible than I had been led to believe. I don't know the reason for the use of a Southern car. Maybe it was because the Hurricane had disrupted traffic badly enough to affect the availability of Amtrak cars. All I know for sure is that it happened.
The James Whitcomb Riley was a NYC run from Cincinnati to Chicago prior to Amtrak. Never paid that much attention to what Amtrak named their trains, however, I suspect Washington to Cincinnati may not have been named the 'Riley', as the C&O's name train was the 'George Washington' and the B&O's was the National Limited - I do know Amtrak did use the National Limited name on a route for several years.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
The National Limited was the ex-B&O name given to what remained of PRRs Spirit of St. Louis (westbound) and Penn Texas (eastbound). The Cardinal name was given to the combined George Washington/Jame Whitcomb Riley in 1972 or 1973.
Amtrak owned or leased all of the cars used on its trains after takeover. Southern Ry cars were used by Amtrak (and, less often, vice versa) under contract rates and joint operation contracts that went back to Penn Central days. Sleeping car attendants (still called "porters" in the early 1970s) bid on jobs the same way they had on railroad jobs, with Amtrak paying the railroads. Porters for extra cars and special moves called from the extra board. Amtrak took over virtually all on-board service employees by the mid 1970s, and most engine service and train crews by the end of the 1970s. Two of the last train service holdouts were crew assignments on the Cardinal in West Virginia (C&O suppled crews) and on CN operated trains north of St Albans VT and Rouses Point NY (something about needing French speaking crews...)
The Amtrak National Limited ran NY & Wash DC - Harrisburg - Pittsburg - Indianapolis - St. Louis - Kansas City. The Washington section ran via the Port Road and not on the Baltimore Northern. A GG1 was used Harrisburg - Washington. Rode it..
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