A little Q from Downunder about the term "idler car"....

[Kozzie]

Hi everyone - I have been posting and commenting on the trains Mag forum, but I have enjoyed the articles in recent issues of Classic Trains mag.

One article in the Fall 2004 edition used the term "idler car" and I haven't heard of that before. Tried to get a handle on it from the context, but I'm still not sure. [:(] Was it used to couple incompatible locos??? [;)]

Thanks for any help on this one. [:D] [;)]

Cheers [:)]

Dave
(Kozzie)
Oz

[gbrewer]

On the Denver & Rio Grande Western they were used to connect narrow gauge engines or cars to standard gauge engines or cars. This, of course, was used when the tracks were of dual gauge (three rails). It was not uncommon for a D&RGW train to have mixed gauge equipment on lines such as the one from Alamosa to Antonito, Colorado.

[leighant]

I'm not sure but.....
I wonder if that term was used in carferry operations, where freight cars were moved across a body of water on a ferry, such as some of the terminal operations in New York harbor which had no rail connections, except by water.

Some ferries could not support the weight of a locomotive without danger of tipping, so empty flat cars were used between the locomotive and the cars being switched onto a ferryboat. Santa Fe called them "boat flats". A list in the Santa Fe Modelers Organization book Work Equipment Cars looks like they had forty of them at one time or another for use in San Francisco Bay and Galveston Harbor. But that article also referred to them as "idler cars" and "idler flats".

[DSchmitt]

Another use of an "idler car" is as a handle . The State Belt RR in San Francisco had "idler flats" so that their switchers could load/unload car floats without going onto the float bridge.

An empty car, usually a flat, but sometines a gondola, used between two cars that are supporting a long load is also an idler car. Idler cars are also used where a load sticks out beyond the car is loaded on.

[Kozzie]

Thanks gbrewer - I hadn't thought of change of gauge...

[Kozzie]

Thanks everyone, [:)] seems like there's a few uses for this type od car...

Dave [:)]

[locomutt]

Kozzie,
You gotten several good answers on this question.
The "idler cars" were generally used between locos and cars going onto a car ferry. The Chesapeake & Ohio,along with other roads,used them on the Great Lakes.
You can also have an idler car with 'long' loads,such as welded rail,which is about 1500',compared to a standard rail section that is only 39'.

[locomutt]

Check the C&O Historical Society,and maybe you can find pictures of them.

[Anonymous]

Hi Kossie
Idler wagons are also used where a train is carrying hazardous goods.
ie loco idler wagon or wagons depending on regs then hazardous goods
then idler wagon or wagons guards van(caboose) or modern train just idler wagon with micky mouse lights and tail disc on it.
Info based on WA (OZ) practices
regards John

[Anonymous]

being an erx switchman and idler was an empty flat car . if you have an open top lumber or machinery of high value an idler consisting of on flat car ahead and behind the type of cars mentioned . that is to protect the lumber or machinery from shifting forward or backwards.

[Allen Jenkins]

Also, Kozzie, idler cars, are used to provide a rotary coupler for a rotary-dump hopper train, as in the Bone Valley Phosphate region of central Florida, USA. The CSX Port of Tampa, operations, used this method, whilst a winch-cable operated "car-haul" pulls the cut to the rotary dumper. The usually empty car is assigned to the particular unit train "turn," usually left with the cars, at the loadout facility. Some Seaboard Coast Line and Atlantic Coast Line trains, crews took the idler wagon with them to use elsewhere. Enjoy Your Hobby, Kozzie! ACJ.

[DSchmitt]

[:D]I thought an idler car was an old caboose on the edge of an rail yard where the crews hid out from the boss[:o)]

[BR60103]

Would the term also apply to a car with a different coupler at one end to pull, say, a rapid transit car or street car, or a foreign loco going to a port?

[locomutt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BR60103

Would the term also apply to a car with a different coupler at one end to pull, say, a rapid transit car or street car, or a foreign loco going to a port?

That is a very interesting question;and I would have to say yes,using the terminology. It would seem to be serving the same purpose.[:)]

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

Dave:
Another use for idler cars is for weight distribution. There is a bottle car (molten steel) train which serves Acme Steel in Riverdale IL immediately south of Chicago. This train is a regular job. The bottle cars are quite heavy when loaded, idler cars (gondolas or flat cars) are used to spread the weight to avoid overstressing bridges on the route.

Paul

[Anonymous]

If I'm correct about the story you where reading about the idler car it was used to spread the weight of two locomotives going over a weight restricted bridge in Kentucky.

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

The Central of Georgia had a similar set-up for one of its branchlines in which old box cars were fitted with MU cables to separate the locomotives due to several restricted bridges.

[Wdlgln005]

The Acme Steel train uses several idler cars. The bottle cars are quite heavy & don't have ggod brakes. I've seen several mentions of extra cars used to provide braking. Also, that's HOT MOLTEN STEEL being transported from the furnace to the mill. I think 2 cars are required as protection from the hot metal to the crews.

[Anonymous]

Idler cars -

A flat car after a crane or derrick, to keep the boom clear of instructions.

[Kozzie]

Thanks again to everyone [:)] who has posted here, I appreciate all this info [:)] - I reckon I'll have to print this lot out and file as reference.[:)]

I hoep others have benefited from these posts too! [;)] [:)]

Cheers

Dave [:)]

[Allen Jenkins]

You sooooooo are welcome Mr. Kozzie! Thanks for posting on the forum, as each post brings memories, and pics, that go deep in the brains, and bring back things which make us feel good to be alive, sharing. The Central of Georgia, a Southeastern United States of America railway, Used their home road boxcars, as revieled by, CSSHegewisch. They also had passenger cars for this service. The CofG could pass their SD7, and SD9's across any bridge(guy"s, correct me if I'm wrong), because the axle weights, and total weight on a short bridge permitted. Same as a Geep. This is why the SD35 was bought on behalf of the CofG, by the Sourthern Railway System, including high short hood. Anyway, pics of the passenger cars are available, with geep, and F unit power. ACJ.

[enr2099]

The flat car in the photo there is used as an idler. The E&N Railway uses seven of these cars to switch the railbarge, the railroad's only connection to the outside world. The flats are used as the locomotives can not run on the approach or apron. The E&N also uses four old coal hoppers as idlers on the road, they're needed when moving hazmat, Transport Canada requires that hazmat has to be moved separated from the locomotives by idlers. Any car can be used as idlers, the E&N often uses four empty propane tankers instead of the old coal hoppers.



And here's a shot of the old coal hoppers, whoops there's actually five of them.

[Allen Jenkins]

Yep, five shorties to the bitter end, ( add so many car lengths to the cut of cars to be picked up). The conductor usually rides the cut into the switch, and he's probably behind the camera, walking to the couple-up. It has been discovered, stepping up on moving equipment, is hazardous, and Grandpa wants to return home to the Grandbabies. Walking. Riding in, is old school, still works, with the old timers, at the throttle. Standing the siding, to uncouple a cut, is called zero-in...not so safe with long cuts. Keep Safe Distance! ACJ.

[M636C]

On a vist to Argentina last year, on the Entre Rios lines of America Latina Logistica (ALL), I saw a train hauled by two G26Cs, a sort of small, light SD38. Despite the fact that these locomotives are already light for standard gauge units, a 50' flat car was coupled between them with long jumper cables strung across its deck. This prevented more than one unit being on a bridge span at one time. This part of the country is the only area with standard gauge, most railways in Argentina being broad (5'6") or one metre gauge.

Peter

[Anonymous]

hey,sorry,but didn't mean to butt in on this. i'm learning a lot from you guys so i would like to ask. what is a peddler freight? what is a way freight??? if you all can help me out i'll be on my way. thanks

[BR60103]

Easter:
I think both terms refer to the same thing: a freight train that stops at intermediate stations to pick up or leave cars. Also called a local freight.
As opposed to a through freight that wouldn't think of stopping in your little town.


Can we define an idler car as a non-revenue car required for operating purposes?