Southern #41 The Pelican at Bristol VA 1952

[Erie Lackawanna]

My dad took this picture of the Southern Pelican (I believe) train #41 at Bristol, VA in 1952 on a journey from New Jersey to Sardis MS (I think he was on the way home by this time).  

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=217611&nseq=0

Anyone able to add any information based on what is visible?  Thanks.  

[cnwfan51]

    Isnt Bristolwhere the Southern and the Norfolk and Western swaped power on that train  The N and W power took oner the train from bristol northward and on the southbound trrip Southern power took the train I could be wrong   hope not   but a Great Picture anyway   Larry

[coalminer3]

Train 41 arrived in Bristol at 10:00 a.m. and departed at 10:10 a.m. It operated via the SOU between Washington and Lynchburg, N&W Lynchburg-Bristol, SOU Bristol-New Orleans.  The IC handled cars from 41 between Meridian and Shreveport. 

Pullmans operated between New York-New Orleans, New York-Knoxville, New York-Shreveport, New York-Williamson, New York-Bristol, Washington-New Orleand, Washington-Roanoke, and Atlanta-Monroe. 

Coaches ren between washington and New Orleans and a diner between Roanoke and Birmingham.

In short, there was something for everybody.

Hope this helps.

work safe

[Anonymous]

The only little detail to add to the above is that the Pennsylvania  R.R.handled the through pullmans  between  New York and DC. That is probably kind of understood, I realize.

[Erie Lackawanna]

Thanks for the info, guys.

As the first picture on this trip is in either Lynchburg or Roanoke (I'm at work, so I can't check at the moment), I have no way of knowing how my dad travelled the first leg of the trip down to Virginia.

Coming back, he took some pictures at the Baltimore & Ohio station in Wilmington DE, but he could have just as easily come down on the Pennsy.

[daveklepper]

I assume the streamlined steam locomotive is an N&W J.

[Erie Lackawanna]

I assume the streamlined steam locomotive is an N&W J.

How do you tell a J from a K2a?  There's an earlier pic with a K2a at the same location (hence the assumption), but I don't honestly know that this is that engine or not... and as far as I can tell, they are indisinguishable unless you are looking directly at the side.

[Anonymous]

I am not a locomotive expert so am confused.  Was the K2a something which strongly resembled a J?  I had always  thought the "J" was  unsual for it extreme streamlined beauty, not easily confused with anything else. Looks  like a J to me, but then I am not a loocmotive person.

 I got "on" to J's when one was used so much in not too long ago years for steam excursions around the southeast, where I live.

[Erie Lackawanna]

The K2a was built as a regular looking locomotive, but later they were streamlined with a duplicate jacket to that used on the J.

I don't know how you tell a streamlined K2a from a J, unless you are able to count the trailer wheels.

Is there a way?

Here's a K2a image -- http://www.brasslocomotive.com/images/trains/SUN-K2A.jpg

Here's a J image -- http://www.trainnet.org/Libraries/Lib014/N_W610.GIF

 

[KCSfan]

I think it's likely a K2a which IIRC was the usual heavy passenger train power on the Bristol line. The J's were primarily found heading the Powhatan Arrow and Cavalier on the Norfolk-Cincy main.

Mark

[daveklepper]

I thought the Tennesian always used a J.   Had forgotton about the K2A's.

[feltonhill]

The J's were assigned to all primary passenger trains on N&W, including the Southern Ry interline trains from Bristol to Monroe.  This route had a lot of grades and curves and a J was particularly well-suited for the run.

The K2's were assigned to secondary passenger trains and the occasional substitution when a J was not available for the primary runs.  The Bristol line saw mostly J's on passenger trains, not K2's.   

By percentage assignment, the loco in the photo is likely a J.  Can't tell otherwise from the front angle.

[BigJim]

I don't know how you tell a streamlined K2a from a J, unless you are able to count the trailer wheels.

The easy way is to look at the fireman's side. The K2/K2a's had a type BL feedwater heater hanging down and this would be covered by a piece of sheetmetal the same shape as the heater.

Also notice that the tender has rivets, where the J's tender was all welded.

[SealBook27]

Thanks for the info, guys.

As the first picture on this trip is in either Lynchburg or Roanoke (I'm at work, so I can't check at the moment), I have no way of knowing how my dad travelled the first leg of the trip down to Virginia.

Coming back, he took some pictures at the Baltimore & Ohio station in Wilmington DE, but he could have just as easily come down on the Pennsy.

   I'm confused.  Are you referring to a second station in Wilmington or the one that Amtrak uses now.  The existing station is the only one I ever saw, and I assumed it was built by PRR since their office building is next door.  But I'll be the first to admit that I might be corrected.

[Erie Lackawanna]

Thanks for the info, guys.

As the first picture on this trip is in either Lynchburg or Roanoke (I'm at work, so I can't check at the moment), I have no way of knowing how my dad travelled the first leg of the trip down to Virginia.

Coming back, he took some pictures at the Baltimore & Ohio station in Wilmington DE, but he could have just as easily come down on the Pennsy.

   I'm confused.  Are you referring to a second station in Wilmington or the one that Amtrak uses now.  The existing station is the only one I ever saw, and I assumed it was built by PRR since their office building is next door.  But I'll be the first to admit that I might be corrected.

No, I'm referring to the B&O station... different building on a different line.

Scroll to the bottom of the first link

http://www.lcpgraphics.org/inventories/B&ORailroad/

http://www.philadelphiabuildings.org/pab/app/pj_display.cfm/37184

 

 

[Erie Lackawanna]

I don't know how you tell a streamlined K2a from a J, unless you are able to count the trailer wheels.

The easy way is to look at the fireman's side. The K2/K2a's had a type BL feedwater heater hanging down and this would be covered by a piece of sheetmetal the same shape as the heater.

Also notice that the tender has rivets, where the J's tender was all welded.

Thanks for this... while it doesn't help in this particular shot, it will help me a great deal in his other shots.

[SealBook27]

    Erie Lackawanna:  thank you ever so much for those links to the B & O.   You just gave me a whole new world to explore.   Countless times in my life  I've passed underneath that  line at Pennsylvania or Delaware Avenues.  And all the times I saw the Augustine Bridge, never once did I see a train on it.  It just never occured to me who built that line. 

[BigJim]

Thanks for this... while it doesn't help in this particular shot, it will help me a great deal in his other shots.

Erie,
   Another easy way to tell the difference is to look at the stripe. If the stripe starts at the top edge of the running board and goes to the bottom edge, it's a J. If the stripe starts a couple of inches below the top of the running board and stops a couple of inches above the bottom, it's a K2/K2a. This can be clearly seen in the pictures above.